Nicola Amadora Transcript

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Nicola Amadora Interview

Rick Archer: Welcome to Buddha at the Gas Pump. My name is Rick Archer, Buddha at the Gas Pump is an ongoing series of interviews with spiritually Awakening people. There have been about 385 of them now. And if you haven’t seen any of the previous ones, feel free to go to batgap.com Bat gap, and look under the past interviews menu where you’ll find them all organized in various ways. This show is made possible by the support of appreciative listeners and viewers. So if you appreciate it and feel like supporting it, there’s a Donate button on every page of the site. batgap.com There’s also a donations page which explains it in greater detail. My guest today is Nicola Amadora, PhD. Nicola was born and did you say Italy or Germany, Germany, Germany, and spent most of her early life living in Germany in Italy? And what did you get your PhD in

Nicola Amadora: transpersonal psychology,

Rick Archer: okay, from where CIIS or something?

Nicola Amadora: JFK university might have a master’s in social work from Germany.

Rick Archer: Great. And reading all the reads and bits and pieces from your biography here that you sent me. You said that your upbringing was fraught with intense abuse and horrors. We don’t need to go into the gruesome details of that too much. But maybe it’d be worth touching upon. You going right to the core? Why not? We can only go up from here.

Nicola Amadora: Good morning Saturday. Yes, so I think that was actually I can see this now as a way of catapulting me very early towards God into what’s awakening, it was for me, because it was so horrific. I had to search very, very early or what I would have killed myself would have died or gone completely insane. So I went for, you know, I went for it. Not just in the moment. I wasn’t brought up with any religious upbringing. In some way. That was a blessing. Yeah. I just went to the church after everybody had left around when I was already eight years old, and just sat in the graveyards and sat in the in the empty church. I started to try to find what else is here. Where’s the light? where’s the where’s God? Where’s love? I was searching for love. Yeah, because I didn’t get any you see. And, yeah,

Rick Archer: I get almost like a category on BatGap of people who had horrific upbringings. It prompted them to, you know, seek God, you know, because there’s a saying that the angels in heaven aren’t interested in enlightenment because heaven so nice. They don’t you know what, they don’t care. But, you know, if life is difficult, we have more of a motivation.

Nicola Amadora: I think, you know, when it’s too comfortable, yeah. You’re not really having the pressure. And and it doesn’t mean you have to have a horrific upbringing. It’s just for me. I felt like I was on the fast track this life. Yeah, it was. It was either this life, or we’re just gonna pack up. Yeah. And so it started very early. And then I left home when I was about, I think 1415. And I searched, I just kept praying every step. I said, show me show me what the truth is, show me what a love is. And that’s when I met somebody in a tiny little attic. And it was an old woman. And I felt like she was my guardian. My guide in that moment. I opened the door and she said, I’ve been waiting for you.

Rick Archer: Well, so, so she was like this little old spiritual woman.

Nicola Amadora: Yes, yes. Very unknown. I just walked into a building where they had some dancing and then I walked upstairs and there she was, and then she I don’t even know her name anymore. She just taught me meditation because that’s what I wanted to learn.

Rick Archer: That’s pretty neat. One of the second person I ever interviewed on This show had a similar experience in Germany. She was, I don’t know, she was out walking or something. And she just ran into this old man herding sheep or something. And it turned out he was this really wise teacher, and he taught her meditate at the age of five. So it must be people like that in Germany wandering around or hiding out in attics.

Nicola Amadora: It was, at that time, in Germany, there was no spiritual book to be found. It isn’t like today where it’s massive amounts of books, everything is available under the sun. There was nothing. There was also no meditation center or anything. It just, you know, I just ran into this woman, and she taught me how to meditate. And my first meditation had to do with centering in the heart.

Rick Archer: And did you kind of stick with it

Nicola Amadora: after that? Yeah. Then I went, of course, then I went to Tizi to France. To be I don’t know if you heard about them. It’s like a very pure form of Christianity that’s not religious in terms of, there is no church behind it. It’s the monks who hit the Jews during the wartime. It’s very beautiful. You just sit on the ground. And it’s like about 14,000 young people come from all around the world. It’s in the big tent that just kept expanding one tent after another. And you sit and you chant, all you do is chant.

Rick Archer: Wow. This is still going on today? Yes,

Nicola Amadora: that’s very big. It’s yeah. And it’s, people just find it. And then, you know, I went to Mother Teresa after that, and went to the Tibetan monks to learn from them. So yeah,

Rick Archer: so you say you did that when you’re 18. So did you just somehow get together the money and hop on a plane and go to India and just start it all by yourself and just find Mother Teresa and so on.

Nicola Amadora: Kind of how you describe, it was like that. It was I finished high school. And I just got my money together. I and then went to India, first one to Sai Baba ashram. And then I went to Kolkata. And that was a huge, I would say that was a huge awakening for me right there in Kolkata. In the slums. Yeah.

Rick Archer: How long did you stay with Mother Teresa?

Nicola Amadora: Half a year, I met us working. I meditated with her. I prayed with her every morning in the little chapel. And then I worked with her alongside often in the house of the dying or the children’s homes. And we went to the slums pretty much every day to feed the people. That’s great.

Rick Archer: And then you I guess, went up to Tibet, did you or let’s see Tibetan monks, or were they in Dharamsala or someplace?

Nicola Amadora: Yeah, there were at the border of Tibet. And I wanted to say something about Mother Teresa, because we we went very fast. And I think for me, I was looking for a teacher that could I would look for people who would embody the love, not just talk the talk. Yeah. And Mother Teresa. I remember that morning when I came up. In Kolkata, I walked along the streets and I entered her little place and I walked up the stairs. And there comes this little tiny nun towards me. And she, she just, I don’t know, she just beamed. And so I just asked her. Where is mother Teresa? Where can I find her? And that was her. It was her. And she just hugged me and I, I just burst into tears. I was so moved by the profundity and the purity of love.

Rick Archer: Yeah, I mean, she was amazing. She had such a beautiful face. And she did such beautiful work. And then, you know, but then after she died, those letters came out that said, Oh, I don’t have any experiences. I’m full of doubts and, and all that stuff. And did you read that stuff after she died? Yeah,

Nicola Amadora: I did. And it’s curious because what she was living in emanating was so joyous. Yeah. And I think, you know, she didn’t have any help to integrate other parts of herself. In the, you know, she has the shadow to like, we all do her humanity. And somehow, I think she didn’t have that real support that we have these days. So this I think part of her was hanging on the sidelines.

Rick Archer: Yeah, well, I must say, you know, I’m much more impressed with someone like Mother Teresa who did such amazing things and, you know, really walked her talk, as you say, and claimed not to have any inner spiritual experiences, then I am with someone who says they’re having all these marvelous experiences and they’re awakened and they’re enlightened. And then they treat people like, you know, like,

Nicola Amadora: I’m so glad you’re saying that because that’s for me. Always the marking of you know, how awake Are you really you don’t need to talk about it. You don’t need to have the ground experiences, but the your action shows your labor show, you know, how you relate. I see this a lot these days in the spiritual scene, where it is so much talk about awakening and experiences and yet the treat each other so badly.

Rick Archer: Yeah. I don’t think you could even be a Mother Teresa, do what she did, unless you really had something significant in terms of your who you are your inner development, you know, even though she may not have maybe it was just a marker of her humility, that she didn’t recognize it in herself. But you know, there must have been really an extraordinary heart and extraordinary mind and just something really on fire for God, you know, to have lived the life she lived.

Nicola Amadora: This is how you put it is the truth. I sat with her every day in the chapel and a tiny little chapel. It was so simple. And she her heart, like spoke miles. Yeah. Yeah. And her actions spoke massively. Yeah, when I entered the house of the dying it, I never forget that. And this was a long time ago, it’s still so vivid with me, where you, I open the doors and walk through and there is this incredible piece that fills the entire room. And literally, those people, you know, was gapping wounds. It’s this is not a pretty sight, and yet the peace is palpable, was palpable in there.

Rick Archer: It’s beautiful. I remember her saying that she kind of regarded everyone as Christ. And she just felt like tending to this person and tending to this person. She was serving Christ directly. She kind of saw the divinity in everyone. She did.

Nicola Amadora: I saw that towards. And for me, that was for me, I felt I found a teacher that was showing me through her actions, how to live like that. How to love Christ, or how to love God and everyone. Yeah. And she did it towards the, you know, the lepers towards the ones that really nobody wants. And she spoke of that wound that that most of humanity carries around is the sense of being feeling deeply unloved or unwanted, and unworthy in the world.

Rick Archer: Kind of sounds a lot like Shama now. We’re talking about Dama before we started, and, you know, you and I both been seeing her for a long time. But she says that very same sort of thing about how everyone needs love, and so many people don’t get it and she just keeps doling it out, you know. And, and she’s even had direct kind of interactions with leper as you’ve probably seen that video where she sucks the pus out of lepers wounds and spits out the blood and so on. The gruesome but the guy ended up getting healing healed of leprosy. But um, you know, I can see how you would be attracted to her having also been attracted to Mother Teresa, who was similar in some ways.

Nicola Amadora: It’s for me, like I said, for me, the two teachers, the one who walked says to her or his talk, and that’s all I wanted. I wanted to know what true love this and I wanted to I was on fire. I mean, it was like a fire week that it, it was burning. I didn’t want anything else. It just was consuming me like, day and night. I need because I had grown up with nothing. So

Rick Archer: so you’re there for six months, and why did you leave?

Nicola Amadora: It was time I knew all of a sudden I just could feel it was time for me to move into the Himalayans I’d never been there. So I packed my bags and I didn’t know how to get there. I just found my way through and ended up exactly where I needed to end up which was highly Himalayan sand. I was ended up in a monastery was Tibetan monks. Now I’ve never heard of them before. Is like I said there were no videos so there were

Rick Archer: no books. What year was this roughly?

Nicola Amadora: Um, that was when I was 19 Oh, wow. I’m so bad with math and don’t let me say my my age okay.

Rick Archer: Now people know They can do the math.

Nicola Amadora: Sorry, I was just really, I can’t quite remember the year but it was, again, I was probably there were only three Westerners there to work guys. And it was at that time, I think llamas llamas SAPA was there too. And they just invited me to go on an intensive. Because I said, I want to grow, I want to be liberated. That’s all I want to know, the truth of life. I, you know, this is it, and I want to do it within one day. I didn’t. I didn’t have time, okay. To wait until I’m 60 or whatever. It just was, like, give it to me now. And the whole and so they said go on the desk retreat.

Rick Archer: How’s that work?

Nicola Amadora: Well, novels that interesting. It was the was the Tibetan Book of the dying. Yeah, we went through 10 days of pretty much 1112 hours sitting in silence. And, and it isn’t like our meditation halls these days, where it’s all cushy and nice. This was on bare cement floor, right? And your after 10 hours, I felt like I can’t even feel my body anymore. It ached everywhere. But I was determined. I’m not I’m not giving up. But after the third day of being led through the stages of feel your body dying, all the cells are dying, all your relatives are dying, everybody you ever loved is dead. You are crumb, you, you becoming like dust. I mean, it’s just like, if it came very detailed, they guided us through. And after a while, I thought on the third day, I thought this is it. This is completely stupid. I’m not wanting to die. I’m here, you know, to live. I’m 19 Excuse me. And this is not working. So I packed my bags.

Rick Archer: You didn’t do the whole 10 days. Oh,

Nicola Amadora: wait, wait, okay, there’s a part of the story. The story, the plot goes a little longer. So I go down the hill. And then I see these monks on the side of the road. And they are singing to this little mount Hill on the side of the road. And then I I looked at them and as I thought What are they doing the singing to an anthill? I thought this is crazy, right? But I was curious. So I sat down and after a while when they finished their chanting, I asked one of the monks and he said well this is the the ants the answer the every being can feed the mother from you know, all of us in another life. We cannot build the roads through their house. So we’re going to we in the chanted them, we’re going to bless them. And then we built the road around the house. And all of a sudden, it hit me. I just realized the depth of compassion they were coming from. So no turn around, walk up the hill again. But you know, got up in the morning at four o’clock in the freezing cold Himalayan air and continue to practice. I just let go of my thoughts and expectations. And at the end, throughout the middle, I just the gate, I felt the gate opened. And I just experienced luminous just just light. Complete light. There was nothing left. Yeah, so after that, it was then that I went to take the Han lift with him.

Rick Archer: Where was he in Thailand?

Nicola Amadora: Now he lived already he had started Plum Village in France

Rick Archer: on France. Okay. Yeah. And then so how long did you stay with tick? Not

Nicola Amadora: Han? Also, I think about six months.

Rick Archer: You kind of did a greatest hits tour. Didn’t you? Say with all the heavies.

Nicola Amadora: I was like I’m not doing with the little thing and just going for the full enchilada. Yeah, I just yeah, it just was clear. This is what I wanted. I wanted I wanted that.

Rick Archer: And so how that what was that like being with tick not Han.

Nicola Amadora: But take the hand of course was very different than for example, when I was living with Sai Baba, you know, or is also different than Amma verite gentle this Plum Village in Southern France. It’s so beautiful. It’s full of some flowers. smell. And there is such a softness and a sweetness there. Particular ham built this, it was very small at the time because he didn’t he wasn’t known very much. So we got up every hour, the bell rang, and we stopped to read, to pause, and to remember Present Moment, Wonderful moment. And then every morning, we walked with him on the meditation walk. So in the beginning, it was like for me, you know, you have to remember I was 19 I was, you know, ready to take the horse and take on the world and ride ahead and set the with the flaming torch. And but he was like, slow, slow down, slow, even slower. And he was also very much about how we relate to each other. So we practiced in the, in the hall with the monks and the nuns we practice together. Compassionate relating. So, yeah.

Rick Archer: So how long did you stay there?

Nicola Amadora: It was about half a year to just wanted it to go really wanted to go really deep. He’s smiling.

Rick Archer: I’m smiling, because I’m enjoying this. And I think this is kind of working well, just working, going through chronologically the various things you did you know, it’s kind of interesting, we didn’t really talk much about the sidebar thing, but that’s alright. But um, it’s sort of interesting how you went through these different phases. And there’s this I don’t know if you remember that, that song by the band that are very few even remember the band, they were a group in the US, but they had a song. They’re from Canada, actually, they had a song in which one line was you take what you need, and you leave the rest. And I like that little phrase, but so you were like a bee kind of going from flower to flower and taking getting something from this flower and then going on to the next flower and yeah,

Nicola Amadora: yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And that was, I was intrigued. You know, I practiced really intensely. Yeah. So I just kept like, on it. I just used to me my whole life. I used a, I’m always one who goes to the core to the essence. And I use the most essential teachings that and then practice, you know, and so with Cigna, Han, I was, I just, I just fell in love with him. He, huh? Yeah, it’s just gentleness is so gentle, and so simple. It’s really simple.

Rick Archer: I’m sorry, say that again? Because your audio broke up for a second. But just the last thing you said wasn’t your fault. Just a technical thing?

Nicola Amadora: Truth to me is really simple. Truth

Rick Archer: is really simple. Yeah. Yeah.

Nicola Amadora: can influence the gentleness it wasn’t the the raw, I have to stop my fast. My fast track, like the fire horse, the fire was had to slow down a little bit, and feel the ground and feel the nourishment like to be, you know, drinking the honey.

Rick Archer: Yeah. Well, you know, 19 year olds are usually pretty wild and impulsive. And I certainly was. Most of us were racing around like crazy at that age.

Nicola Amadora: I was ready to do to grow or you know, build a revolution. That’s where I was. Yeah. That’s a very wild one. But you know, that’s why I was afterwards I went into the jungle. So if we keep the chronological journey,

Rick Archer: yeah, let’s keep doing that. That’s that’s working nicely. So you went from southern France to a jungle?

Nicola Amadora: Yes. Well, first, first, I went I don’t know what came first one was yeah, I went into the jungle into the Amazon because I wanted to learn from the indigenous people. For my real tribe, right. So and you have to remember at that time, there was there was no two books there was no guided journeys by I just put myself on a bus and hoped I would get there and you don’t know if you get there when you’re in Ecuador, and you’re going right down right down those dirt roads. Yeah.

Rick Archer: Don’t know if you’re gonna come out alive actually.

Nicola Amadora: I realized that later.

Rick Archer: What were you doing for money all this time and you must have had some savings or some money or something that you’re buying plane tickets with and stuff?

Nicola Amadora: No, you know, what I did? Was I went to at the same time. So what I did, I went on a journey. And then after I came back from Tina Hannah actually enrolled in social work in a master’s Great. And so doing, we had long breaks. So we had like three months summer break, and I think a month or two months, winter break. And then during the time I studied, I worked as well every day. And so any money, you know, my money went, of course to food and to my studies, but any money I could save aside of that, I just put in a little box and wrote down my next journey.

Rick Archer: So you’re getting your master’s degree, but somehow rather at the age of 19, you’d already gotten a bachelor’s degree and you’re moving on to the masters?

Nicola Amadora: No, it was like, first bachelor’s. And then you know, I went towards the masters. So I did it all in one swoop. And one goal, one thing? Yeah. In Germany, you could do it because it’s not so divided. You see, in America, it’s like, bachelor’s, master’s, right. But in Europe,

Rick Archer: it’s kind of combined. II this combined

Nicola Amadora: is, especially if you studying for, like, let’s say social work or engineering, it’s its own. Its own track was its own ending, and you can’t end before that.

Rick Archer: Okay, so you got to Ecuador. I mean, you were went to the jungle. And obviously, Ayahuasca wasn’t fashionable in those days. But is that what you ended up doing? Or was it some other kind of work with indigenous?

Nicola Amadora: I never was into using any of these things. No, I wanted the purest of the pure I wanted to direct, I didn’t want to have any. You know, I felt like if I can’t access it here and open to it. The rest is just an excursion. That’s just my, you know, and maybe for other people, it will help. For me, it wasn’t an option. It was I just went to them. And I remember I stood at the river and on the bank of a river. They told me the little touches my heart had learned Spanish. So I asked them, you know how to get to this indigenous tribe. And they said, Oh, just take that next boat with these guys. So I’m like, Okay. I’ve never been in a jungle. I didn’t have any stuff, for preparation that people take with them know, mosquito repellent, or whatever. I just didn’t know about it. And I didn’t really care that much. As a set in the boat, I realized, it dawned on me and was two guys in a boat. I don’t know where I’m going. And I wonder where I will end up. I just in that moment, I just prayed, I asked, guide me where I need to be guide me to the people that will show me something that I need in order to be able to help others later. You know, there were that that charm, the charm that tried to charm me and I just made it clear that I’m not available. I told him, I made up that I’m married which I wasn’t, but it helped. I climbed out of the boats. And then I walked into credible thick jungle. And I came to this tiny little village. She was like in these I don’t know how to describe it in English. But these were just made from leaves, the branches, the little huts. And we didn’t understand we had no language for each other in terms of human language. Yeah. So I had to learn to speak in sign, you know, with hands and my face

Rick Archer: because they didn’t even speak Spanish. And they’re right. They’re speaking some indigenous language. Yeah.

Nicola Amadora: But you know, what was amazing? After a while when I worked with the women, and they showed me how to gather the verbs, and they made the food and I helped them. It was it was the sense of coming into oneness with them. And understanding them. It was the heart all of a sudden I could feel the heart knows that language. Yeah. And it started opening in me more and more. And I began to hear and understand the animals in the jungle. And the plants and so they can’t they allowed me to be there and showed me things. Some point the shaman came, but they had a village you know, they had a tribal Shaman. And somehow he I don’t know if he had a death wish on me or if he took a liking to me. I have no idea But they kind of made it clear. So my my stay at there was coming to an end and they made it clear that they would like to offer me an initiation. I thought great. I love that. Of course. I was so curious the whole time to discover. So he, he guided me and he said, Well, it could mean death. It said, either you end up like this finished. Or good. I was like, Okay, I have nothing to lose, you know, saved your life. I have well. So I was blindfolded. And then they put a really heavy weight onto my shoulders. And he took the blindfold off. And then that moment, my heart literally, it felt like it stopped.

Rick Archer: Let me guess it was a big snake.

Nicola Amadora: It was an anaconda. Wow, I just guessed that. You had you got to transmission from it? Maybe? Yeah. Yeah. And this Anaconda shot towards me. Yeah. And I could feel she would, there would be many, I had 30 seconds, and she would strangle me. So this was the moment of great terror. And I knew that everything I had practiced thus far, had to come in now to help me because what do you do when you stand in the midst of terror? And this is not just an imagined terror or from a past experience. This is like for real. I just knew one thing I just from my inwardly I said, ground down to earth. So I felt I had to feel my feet. I was shaking like a leaf. You know, it was just, I didn’t like snakes at that time. So she came closer and closer and I just let really present moment. Wonderful moment. Breathe in, breathe out. I just, I just breathe into my belly. I looked at her eyes, and then I let myself feel my heart. I love myself to feel the love and my heart. And centered. In that moment, it was like by magic. She slowly she felt it. She slowly came down slowly, slowly, slowly. And when I was completely connected with her, and my fear had just vaporized she just laid on my belly.

Rick Archer: Did you sit down or lie down so she could lie in your belly? Yeah, yeah.

Nicola Amadora: I sat down with her started stroking her. Wow. I fell in love with that snake.

Rick Archer: That’s pretty amazing.

Nicola Amadora: It is. So it was so beautiful. Because I felt like I got an initiation that was to do was to Shakti it was to do with the feminine. The feminine is the snake and I had been afraid of snakes. Yeah. And she was the moment I just connected more and more. It was like, Ah, here we are. Where we won, we connected. Something opened like it was really powerful that opened in me and hasn’t left me ever since.

Rick Archer: Yeah, based on your last sentence. I mean, I was gonna ask you so what did you take away from that experience? What kind of permanent effect do you feel that had on you? Maybe you could even just elaborate a little bit on that.

Nicola Amadora: There opened in me a power and a connection to the earth. And a sense of like, oneness was all the result creation. There was this this to this day, I can hear the animals speak to me. I can hear the plants. I can. I can center in the moment what his greatest fear.

Rick Archer: Yeah. Interesting. Well, I don’t want to disrupt the chronological story.

Nicola Amadora: But no, but I appreciate those questions. Yeah. Well,

Rick Archer: at some point, we’re going to talk about Findhorn. Maybe that’s not the next thing chronologically. Okay, because this what you’re saying now relates to that, but let’s keep going in geology.

Nicola Amadora: So, because it has, it had such a profound impact on me. It was like you know, was the Tibetans in the mountains it was illuminating me from here. And in the jungle, it came from below. It was the sense of this darkness, this juiciness. This lifeforce is God is the goddess is. I don’t even like the word use this word. I just use it. I just would like to say it’s lifeforce and that for me is Holy, that is sacred. Yeah. This is where we so often are connected. Yeah. Disconnected. So she opened she helped me open that up. And after that, I felt I wanted to be more in the wilderness.

Rick Archer: Yeah. Well, I can’t see this Anaconda thing becoming a popular tourist attraction kind of thing. But you got that experience.

Nicola Amadora: I wouldn’t recommend it. Well, you know, the shamans, the shamans, if you know if you get an initiation from a shaman, they take you it’s a life and death one. Yeah. True. shamanic initiation is like, truly life and death. You know, so, and I don’t think many of them, you know, there’s not too many Westerners who like to do that. And I understand that I wouldn’t do it if I had met. You know, I have a kid now. Yeah. But I felt to me, it opened me up to the feminine in a very deep way. The, you know, this what is sacred in the living in.

Rick Archer: And so then you said, you, you went even deeper into the wilderness into the jungle or something. So still there or somewhere else

Nicola Amadora: I went to. So I went horseback worked, studied, and then I went back to in the wild in Mexico, with a horse alone into the wilderness

Rick Archer: was a little weird. Going back to school in Germany after having these amazing experiences, you know, in the jungle and things like that.

Nicola Amadora: Believe me, I felt like I was living on in three different worlds.

Rick Archer: I felt like you were from outer space or something. And I couldn’t talk

Nicola Amadora: with anybody about it. Yeah. I couldn’t share. This was nobody because people were not. It wasn’t the age where people were sharing those things.

Rick Archer: So yeah, what did you do on your summer vacation? Well, yeah, I got

Nicola Amadora: I went into the Himalayan Yeah, actually.

Rick Archer: Cool. I went to the Riviera. Okay, so you went back to school, and all that and had another session of that. And

Nicola Amadora: well, and I went in to New Mexico, New Mexico, in New Mexico, I was looking to find my dream was to find a horse that I could ride in the wilderness. And as a Western woman, this is not a good idea to go to Mexico to Spain. Yeah. To any place. I needed wilderness and wanted the horse needed to be safe from, you know, too much male attention,

Rick Archer: right. So he went to New Mexico, the US State,

Nicola Amadora: I met somebody who had a farm. This was completely by synchronicity again. And he had an Arabian horse farm, and I said, you know, I would train a horse for him. And he said, I’ll offer you a horse to go out into the wild with what it’s like.

Rick Archer: And at that point, you actually knew something about training horses.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah, I had. I had been with horses all my life. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Horses. So part of my companions. Yeah.

Rick Archer: Okay, so you, you went out into the wilderness of New Mexico with Arabian horse. Yeah.

Nicola Amadora: And her name was sorry, is beautiful. We select on the, you know, we slept on them to starlit sky and in total wilderness and just met the elks and the coyote came to my fire and I, in that it’s stillness, all I was craving for was to be still to really hear the spirit communing through all of nature. And I knew I had to be alone, and I had to be completely connected with nature in order to hear and then I fasted I just didn’t eat for two weeks. Just got my water from the stream and rode through the mountains passes. I didn’t know where I was going, it didn’t really matter. And it was I just kept praying open the gates for me open the gates. I’m, I’m I’m surrendering. Just please show me. And it did. I felt like the veils were dropping more and more with every day and also had asked for For my life, what is my life’s work? What What am I here to do? You know, it wasn’t just to learn from great teachers, I felt I had a calling to contribute to humanity. I didn’t want to just travel around for my own. Whatever entertainment. Yeah, right. It was very purposeful. And so what happened was, the more I was still and listened, and the more I encountered, like I encountered a wild bear, and I could come really close to the bear. And the more I was, I came into harmony with nature, the more I came into my own nature, I just came home more and more. And then, I mean, that’s just still brings tears to my eyes, because it’s so present right now is one one day when I was just sitting and meditating. I just heard such a strong voice. That just told me what I’m here for.

Rick Archer: What did I say? Well, maybe it wasn’t words, maybe it was more of an intuitive thing.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah, it was like in to teach that to be that. Yeah, at that, at that time. Again, I didn’t, I’m glad I didn’t have a concept. I didn’t have a book that told me those words, it was fresh, it came very strong and powerful. It was you you are that and bring this love to the world. teach that. Live that show that be that. And in that moment, I just felt I mean, there was more.

Rick Archer: You can say more.

Nicola Amadora: Very personal, you know, we don’t

Rick Archer: have to, but if you want to people find it interesting.

Nicola Amadora: It’s very deep. It was very. And it showed me things that happened in the future that would happen in the future, that had to do you know, with the sense that I created but that also had to do with the part of my work in the world. And it it illumined me, it just illuminate my whole being it was just the light was just pouring out of me and through me. I am I just felt like everything, just couldn’t move anymore for hours sitting there. And it was like entering into the Beyond and yet being at the same time for here. Very natural. Yeah. And the ego started circling me. And we all the beings and nature started responding. It wasn’t like I was a separate self anymore. It was I’m part of this, I’m one with this. So from that moment, you know, I had many awakenings. But this moment took me to be very clear, it was very clear where my path was to go also in the world because like I said, I wasn’t satisfied to just awaken in me or to have experiences I wanted to be of service Yeah. This is very important on my in my life. And so I went was my horse. I went back to civilization.

Rick Archer: Before we get back to civilization did the predictions that that voice give you end up happening, most of them all of it. And

Nicola Amadora: it was Sigler it was like a thunder voice. You know, it was in these reddish mountains, the rock there the foothills of the Rocky Mountains. I don’t know he’s ever been there. To mount Sure.

Rick Archer: Very beautiful outside of Santa Fe or someplace.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah. Further in way further in

Rick Archer: cancer.

Nicola Amadora: He did. That’s very beautiful. And so this the voice was, and I feel like it’s my it was my own voice. Maybe my own being or it was I call it God’s spirits voice. Speaking through the mountains. It was like Sundar, it really shook. shook me.

Rick Archer: Yeah, I was gonna ask you a question like that. Because I’m always curious about this sort of thing. You know whether such voices and such inspirations are a really just some aspect of our own self, our own being, which ultimately everything is you can take it to that level and say, well, everything is aspect of yourself. But, but or whether they’re just the sort of, I don’t know what you want to call them, just the sort of beings that that intercede in human affairs, and that helped to guide people who are open to guidance and, and that kind of thing. You know, it’s just I find it an interesting thing to, to consider.

Nicola Amadora: I think they’re both to what you just said. Yes. And one way we’re all it’s all our true self reflected, you know, and many, at the same time, there’s also that voice that still small voice, it’s called, yeah. inside of you, you know, the divine in you. And then I feel there’s also my, in my experience, there’s also beings that literally come to help. Yeah. So for me, it’s both. Yeah,

Rick Archer: I was just talking with a friend yesterday. And he was saying that he seems happier than I’ve ever seen him. I’ve known this guy for 40 something years. And he, he said, he’s done some adventures recently, he went to Spain on a spiritual retreat. And then he went to India on a spiritual retreat and got initiated by the Shankaracharya, and stuff like that. But he was saying, however, how he sleeps so much less now every morning, he wakes up around four. And he more often than not gets these messages. He says, I know it’s not me. There’s something there’s something, something other than me, and I just get these little downloads every day. Have some some knowledge, some inspiration. So I found that interesting.

Nicola Amadora: I think that happens more and more to people these days. Yeah, somehow the veil is thinner. And people are more open and people are more ready. You know, I’ve gotten all my life. I’m a communicator. I love relating. I love communicating I love sitting with you right now. And, you know, relating with you. I am also I relate, I can hear the saints and the sages speaking to me, I can hear the animals and creatures. And I can also sense very clearly when it’s my own. This is my own essence that speaking. Yeah. Yeah. And more and more I had to decide to learn to decipher to really discriminate what is truth? And what is just the mind chatter? Yeah, the mind can disguise itself as an angel. Sure. And you know, in one way it’s it’s also the form the the mind and its essence. Even the thoughts in its essence is coming from the lifeforce is coming from the Shakti. However, it’s, it can be so distort, it can create so many delusions. Yeah. So I had to really step really into stillness to be able to hear true and center here in my heart.

Rick Archer: I’m glad you’re saying that. I mean, there’s so many people, some of whom I’ve interviewed some of whom I haven’t, who say things like, you know, I’m channeling Saint Germain, or I’m channeling you know, Mary Magdalene, or Mother Teresa, some somebody or Jesus or whatever. And, you know, I give them the benefit of the doubt and, and, you know, some, most of the ones I’ve interviewed who say that sort of thing I, I pretty much believe. But I also have run into people whom I wouldn’t invite for an interview, and there was one guy who was trying, who just, you know, said he was channeling all these things, and he just had so much ego, you know, and he just seems so full of himself. And, and I just kind of like Wonder, I mean, it seems like one can kind of tap into a level of creativity, some people can and just kind of speak from there and come up with all kinds of information. But is it really from some higher source? Or is it just one is just being creative? You know, they’re, they’re doing a poor imitation of Harry Potter or Lord of the Rings or something with their with their imagination?

Nicola Amadora: I love Harry Potter. I think what you bringing up is a very important point because there’s so many there is so many people who do channeling these days and I have respect for people who really trying to make sure that they have a pure opening. To me, I don’t practice channeling because I feel at least in my in my world here. It’s it’s like, I don’t need to channel another being. I just need to be open to the truth from the source directly. And then let it live through me or let it speak through me in this moment. Yeah. And with the channeling, sometimes what I’ve seen is the ego starts taking it and saying, Well, now I’m really special because I get to channel Mary Magdalene Right. And I, I’m the previous incarnation of for I, my, you know, I hear a lot of people who say like, um, I have been sent you mean, and I have been Mary Magdalene? Well, there’s a lot of people who have been her parents

Rick Archer: are alive at the same time.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah. For me, it’s like, you know, this is not special. In one way, it’s the most natural thing if we can commune. Yeah, yeah. And, and for me, if you channeling, I would say, I would say those people in Africa, give one message, be extra careful. And don’t make don’t put your ego. Don’t put the ego on the altar. Because you, you know, you’re worshiping yourself.

Rick Archer: And you may not be may actually be opening up to something other than yourself. But as a friend of mine said, you know, just because you’re dead doesn’t mean you’re smart. So, you know, who knows who what you’re opening up to?

Nicola Amadora: There’s a lot of stuff that starts coming in, because there’s a lot of beings who want to talk. Yeah. And in they can even disguise themselves as the holy ones. You know, so I felt like, for me, the guideline was always this. See, what if it’s simple. If it’s true, if it’s pure route in, in my body, really feel my body? Because if I’m not in my body, you know, I’m, I’m disassociating somehow, and then sense my heart, or feel the love. And then allow this wareness to completely open wide. Completely wide, was no sick. Every, every, every hold. Let’s go. And just be still.

Rick Archer: Yeah. That’s good. And perhaps this is the final cautionary note on this whole theme is, you know, for those who aren’t channeling, but who maybe are attracted to some people who are, use your discrimination, you know, I mean, this guy I referred to that wanted to be interviewed, and I declined. He had this whole little group of people around him who said, well, so and so said, this, Saint Saint Germain is actually St. Germain speaking. So we should all do it, you know, and, and so some of the advice was very questionable, to say the least.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah, people love, they’re looking for a father or mother. And a lot of people do. And a lot of people like to look at, oh, there’s somebody higher, who knows the way and for me, the discrimination, we can just see, is somebody real? Is that person real? Is that person actually approachable as a human being? This person has some maturity today, you know, not perfectly, but they live what they preach. Yeah. And, you know, I, it comes down, comes down to, you know, I repeat this word, maybe too many times, but it comes down to something simple.

Rick Archer: Yeah. Let’s see here. Somebody asked a question. And it kind of relates to what we’re saying it just this just came in from one of the live viewers. So let me just ask you this. Now. She said, this is Florence from Germantown, New York, she said. Please discuss your experience with how the enlightened mind informs us. I’m not asking about synchronicity and waiting for signs that are too uncanny and arrived by chance. I’m not asking about intent, intention and attention. I’m asking about that something that engages from a higher state of consciousness, where there’s clarity, and knowing without words and analysis, even knowing what you didn’t know that you didn’t know. I think what she’s saying is, you know, did you get it? Or do I need to elaborate? You got it. Okay.

Nicola Amadora: And what she’s asking to thank you, Florence, by the way, that’s her name. Yes, Florence. Yeah. Thank you for that beautiful question. What you really asking is how to come in. To be in direct attunement was the source itself.

Rick Archer: Yeah. And I read a previous version of her question was a little longer. And I also got the impression she was saying, you know, these impulses of intuition and knowledge and guidance that we seem to get the kind of thing we you and I’ve been talking about for the last few minutes. She kind of wants to know more about that, and and how I think basically kind of what we’ve been addressing, you’ve been talking about clarity and silence as the prerequisite to making sure that you’re not being confused or misguided or indulging in your own imagination.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah, it’s also What I am, what I want to address is that if you don’t pay attention to the shadow aspects of your own self, they will interfere. But if you if you allow what she expressed the enlightened mind and I call it also the Enlightened heart and enlightened body to allow it to completely be open to that what is put it in the words of that what is infinite that what is internal, but that what is also it’s, it’s pulsating in every cell of yours right now. Yeah, you can feel it in your smile, Rick, right. Yeah, it’s, it’s right now present between us. And you can sense it because you’re opening yourself to it. And then that moment, we’re dropping into the silent communion with each other. But it’s also what Florence asked is, this is the place when you the most you drop open. The awareness is expanding. The mind is still ilm, you enter, the heart starts blossoming. There’s love. And that moment is source communions. It’s not as a separate thing, it just is communing right now with us. And can feel how the energy starts shifting right now with us. Yeah. Yeah.

Rick Archer: Yeah. And I would suggest that it’s, it’s good to find a means whatever works for you to culture, that unbounded awareness, if you want to call it that, so that it’s not something you just want to try to tap into occasionally, but something that becomes the bedrock of your life, you know, thank you, what, whether you’re sitting in meditation, or driving in traffic, you know, intense, intense traffic, that’s, that’s there as the background or even the foreground of your experience.

Nicola Amadora: I would say, all my spiritual practice has led to this, that I can do this in this moment with you, or can drop in easily. Yeah, it is actually where I would say, you do need spiritual practice. For at some point, all those practices, all these techniques fall away. But until then, it’s good to practice, too. Now, this is why meditation practice comes in handy.

Rick Archer: Yeah. That’s what Shama says, Since we spoke about how much she says, you know, if you’re crossing a river in a boat, there will come a time when you’re going to get to the other shore, and you’ll you’ll want to get out of the boat, but don’t do that in the middle of the river.

Nicola Amadora: And that’s where it’s good, you have yours, you practice, you know, awareness. And you practice the lovingness. One, or is the awareness one or the lovingness. And you practice, you know, being loving to others and caring, but also being mindful of what you’re doing and what’s happening. And at some point, the oars drop away, you step out of the boat. And that’s how I, that’s how I always have seen how a true communion is actually strengthened. What can ever happen? Before the vessel isn’t open? We do have a personality, we do have a mind if that isn’t aligned, your connection is going to get wacky.

Rick Archer: Yeah, I read someplace on your website, you say, Well, I’m I don’t consider myself enlightened. And I don’t know if I consider anybody enlightened if we understand that term to mean some kind of ultimate final, you know, realization beyond which there’s no possibility of any any further, you know, growth or development. I don’t know if I’ve ever met anybody who would claim that even possibly Arma. So, you know, maybe, maybe there’s always going to be some kind of boat.

Nicola Amadora: I feel, in my experience advanced, you know, I have this I had immense illuminations. I mean, they just be on the come out of a storybook, the kind of experiences I’ve had throughout my life. And yet, there was always a phase where the personality came in, and old stuff came up, and I had to deal with it in order to integrate it. And I thought that was the time where it was really naive. I said, That’s it. It’s it. It’s done. We’ve really done hope so. You know, as the mind wants to be done with it, I want to package it up and put it in a box. And then I did that. But it doesn’t work that way, my experience is more, the more I open into that stream of grace, the more I allow my, my being to take hold of me, it, it does bring up a treacherous Apple stuff, it brings up things that you know, from way back whatever lifetime it doesn’t matter. It’s it wants to it wants to, I almost feel like this, this love wants to bring everything home. So and the bigger the bigger the opening, the bigger the illumination, the more there is space to bring even more home.

Rick Archer: Yeah. The bigger the bucket or the container, the more mud you can resolve it, you know, if it’s water, yes, yes. If it’s an ocean you can throw a lot in. But even that even that theory is being tested these days are the junk? Oh, well, yeah,

Nicola Amadora: that’s in question. I would say. Yeah. And I just feel that when, when we open deeper and surrender at the same time, it’s just fine dance. Yeah. Because it’s building that clarity, opening to that clarity and that stillness, and at that same time. Then also to surrender. Yeah. So for me, it’s like, you know, with Xamarin, for example, there’s a lot of devotion, which I really appreciate. And yet sometimes I feel there’s the element missing of the awareness. So, to me, it needs both with devotion, and then the day, it’s almost like a non attachment to anything. That stillness.

Rick Archer: If you remember peace, pilgrim, you know who Peace Pilgrim was? Yes. Yeah, I encourage people to look her up. And there’s this little book called Peace Pilgrim, you can read about her life. But she was this woman who just basically walked around the United States for years with nothing but a pair of sneakers, and, you know, clothes on her on her body, and no money, no food, everything was she just threw herself herself on the mercy of the Divine to take care of all of her needs. And, and it worked out for, but the reason I brought her up is that she has in her book, this little chart that she drew about how, at a certain stage, you know, you’re kind of making progress, but it’s by virtue of individual effort, there’s individual effort involved, you said, you reach a certain junction point where the individual just really surrenders. And, and at that point, your progress really accelerates. But it’s, it’s really because you’re kind of you’ve reached the point at which you can be out of the way and just let nature take care of it for you.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah, yeah. It’s the 100% effort. And then the 100% Surrender. Yeah. You have to you have to walk up the mountain then in order to fly. You jump off the mountain. And it’s the fears initially that they will not carry you. They the air the wind won’t carry you with the divine force is carrying us all the time. It’s just the mind gotten stuck a little bit.

Rick Archer: Yeah. Well, it sounds like in your life, you definitely did the effort phase, you know, with my shirt, man, sir. Oh, yeah, that’s right. journeys are hard workers. notorious for that.

Nicola Amadora: No, they just good to have a little bit Italian fun.

Rick Archer: Yeah, good mixture. So we kind of left you leaving the jungle and going back to school. And let’s get back to the chronology here. What what next?

Nicola Amadora: Until the wilderness journey, the vision, oh, yes, the

Rick Archer: horse right, with the Arabian horse in the wilderness. And that was a very profound and significant one, then you but the certain point is you came back to civilization.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah. And then I just knew that I had to, I just had to get the skills in order to contribute to the, you know, the environment. I was very passionate about ecology, and still am. Social justice. I feel my and to, you know, really, I saw so much suffering and people just saw it in their eyes right away. Yeah. So their heart and somehow, somehow my sight opened at the same time and I could feel not just my own, but also other people. The suffering so I dug in and just saw Okay, find skillful means to help relieve suffering in this world and bring happiness.

Rick Archer: So what did you do pursue more education or?

Nicola Amadora: Yeah, I felt like I needed for me I’m very much into whoa, hold. Yeah. Like, um, spirituality has always been my number one L but I felt you need skills in order to communicate right with each other. You need skills how to deal with your shadow material. Yeah. And you need skills to, you know, lead people how to be you need to know how to grow a vegetable garden, this. I can stand there and be in my lumen self that’s just being Yeah. And it’s B and beam. But nothing. I’m not gonna grow a vegetable garden unless I learn how to put the plants in and water them.

Rick Archer: Yeah, good point. I wouldn’t want the Dalai Lama to do brain surgery on me or something. He doesn’t have the skills, you know?

Nicola Amadora: Exactly. Yeah. So and I felt my my path has been very much about, you know, embodiment, like living it with. No, it does a lot of social action service and a lot of environmental service as well. And so that’s what I did. And I went to Findhorn.

Rick Archer: You may have noticed, I interviewed David Spangler a few months ago, he was David there at that time.

Nicola Amadora: He was briefly and he already had left. So it was there was only Ellen Keti was the main person she was there.

Rick Archer: What would you do if you were there for seven years? It says,

Nicola Amadora: Yeah, I was working there as an educator, and worked, basically gave me the training to work with lots of different people from all different countries. It was an excellent training, it was really hard work. Keep living in community was not the easiest. It’s like a washing machine. Yeah. It just gets tumbled and tumble. And you wonder, when is the pause button being pushed? Where is the stop button. So it was a good training. And I was also I gave birth there for my was my daughter. And then I just felt after seven years of felt like it’s time to move on and create. What, what wants to be created from that vision that I had gotten?

Rick Archer: Yeah. Would you say that that vision that you had out in New Mexico, when you’re out there with fasting and with the horse? Would you if there’s one kind of watershed moment in your life where it was a big shift? big turning point? Was that it?

Nicola Amadora: One of them? I had after that many? I had so many is this like it just kept going? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. That was one of them. And yeah, that was clear.

Rick Archer: Feel free to tell us some more as we go along here, if there’s some significant ones you want to talk

Nicola Amadora: about? Okay, there’s probably, there’s probably two more major ones that I can speak of. So we’ve fast forwarding a little bit, because then I was in California already, and was, you know, created a spiritual educational center for families, for couples for women, and leaders just taught, and we had this amazing permaculture garden temples, and it was very, very beautiful. It was like a model of how you can live in a holistic way on this earth together. But in that time, I had several of several things happened. I mean, maybe I should share. So something happened, that was really, really hard in my life. And I had to do with this beautiful center that I had built up at the time I was married. And my ex husband, I could I could feel that he was going going off the deep end by being involved with stock market. Yeah. So we had a nonprofit organization and it was it was going really big and beautiful. But he did things that were for me out of alignment and not an integrity. And they put our center at risk. It put it in a one day I found out he had basically made enormous debt and we had nothing to eat anymore. So this is when I went to the mountain, because I was I was shaken to the core. It was like a put in everything. I put my heart and I put my life in I thought we were going the right direction. And here the rug was being pulled under me. Why? Yeah. And I just, I went actually to Manchester, I spent. Again, this is what I do when I really want to commune in a deep way and really open was like, you know, I just said, you, you ripping everything away, I’ve done. I’ve done what I what I meant to do what now what’s going on? So after I went through the phase of grieving and shaking, and you know, the fear of what’s going to happen, day again, I entered this, just open into this deep silence. And in that moment, I just said, Okay, I just surrender my entire life. I just surrender even deeper. There’s nothing else I could do. Is it hurt so bad to lose what you built up with so much love and labor? And I had already at that time, I had a daughter, and she was so in the news, I had gotten on the center, you know, and and my ex husband was so bad. I mean, I’m just skimming the surface right now on it. So it was like, Okay, if if you want me to let go of this, too. I just, I felt I’d been stripped. And from there on, it felt like my, I’ve been stripped, everything was going, like my center was going on money was going like, My car got smashed by a truck. I mean, it went, you know, I mean, it went extreme.

Rick Archer: Your marriage sounds like your marriage was going at that point. The marriage was going

Nicola Amadora: on? I divorced him and everything went like it had blossoms. And then it won’t. It was like the Mandela, the Tibetans filled with so much care. And then they blow and it’s all gone. It’s easy to do when you have a sound mandola. But it’s your life. And it’s your entire life. It hit me hard. I mean, it wasn’t. So I just I just like, I watched it, how it went. I mean, it was like work everything it was, you know, and after three months, I was stripped bare. So this is when I went to the mountain and I just said, Okay, what do you want? And it was, what do you want? Was not asking just God it was asking my, my being who I am. And I was I was finished. I laid on the ground on the map. And I said, I don’t want any more. I’m done. I just pack up, get me out of here. And I remember that moment, what just I kept I just allowed myself to surrender even deeper. And it was unbelievable what happened then it was just again, it was the sense of the gates just opened and there was a grace that put through I just wept. I just wet it just wrote I literally lifted me up from the ground. I stood up and she stood there and it was like illuminating everything and I just heard for this you were born and it just stood in that for the longest time and it was I just felt it’s grace. There’s no words thinking capture that and yet it felt not out of this world It felt so the most natural thing that could I felt what have I been before and then people started lining up and asking for blessings out of the blue

Rick Archer: so when it said for this you are born, what it meant what that realization was this inner experience you’re having at that moment you were born to have this awakening this realization is that what you meant by that?

Nicola Amadora: Thinking meant more like for this you’re born for this you live this is who you are. This this this this light this light. Okay, just love that was pouring through. So it

Rick Archer: wasn’t so much that you were born to do this project or that project. It was more to just live this life.

Nicola Amadora: Live this? Yes, wherever you go. Live it unabashed, radical, soft, tender fears. Doesn’t matter. Be true to this. Go ahead. Yeah. My German you Yeah, go ahead. Well, I

Rick Archer: was just gonna say so people started lining up for blessings. And what did that mean? Exactly? How are you offering blessings.

Nicola Amadora: I just people came, I didn’t know what I would do. This wasn’t planned. This wasn’t. This felt so natural. One person I just touched on their heart on the forehead and other prisoners said the right words, and they burst into tears. Some people had major openings in their heart, some people felt sweetness. Some people just offered a word, it, it was like, Oh, this is easy. This is easy. This is how it’s supposed to be. In some ways, it feels like to the mind, it feels like this grand miracle. But really, in the heart of heart, it felt so this is natural. It’s just as simple. And so I just could feel okay, is this need to keep allowing this? Just allow it?

Rick Archer: That’s great. And I could ask you when this was without revealing how old you are, well, where are we at now? In terms?

Nicola Amadora: That’s about seven years later and think, six years? Five years? Five, five years later? Yeah.

Rick Archer: later than later than what?

Nicola Amadora: I’m when that happened on the mountain

Rick Archer: lay? Okay. Let me so we’re talking about this happened 10 years ago, 20 years ago?

Nicola Amadora: That happened 10 years. Okay, good. So

Rick Archer: 2006 or something?

Nicola Amadora: Okay, eight years or so.

Rick Archer: And these days, it seems like you’re doing a lot of different things. I mean, if I look through your website, there are so many different types of things you do with people or four people, you know, various. Anybody can go to your website and look at all this stuff. But, you know, relationship counseling and feminine wisdom, wisdom and leadership and, you know, all kinds of courses on mindful parenting and the heart of relating and all kinds of things. I mean, you can enumerate some of them. So, somehow or other you took this experience of the light and again, channeled it into service in the world concrete service, not just you weren’t content to have it be a lovely subjective experience.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah, I, I always have many pots on the stove. Yeah. I always tried to be just teaching satsangs or just to write, you know, teach on a particular subject. I can’t. It’s like, it’s like the jungle, I’m, I’m a plant of many flowers. And, at the same time, I, the main thing is that it comes from the source directly. So the outlet for me is like I can see how sorry about that. It’s something in the way. How I see in the world, that a lot of problems are happening in relating, yeah, between people, between people, so that we, we can have all this awakening, but we still don’t relate with each other.

Rick Archer: Yeah. And not only on an individual level, but I mean, you know, the, the Congress can’t talk to each other that the factions there. And the whole millions of people in the population who align themselves with one or the other of those factions can’t talk to each other, sometimes within the same family. So there’s definitely a sort of a, a golfer, a rift that probably could needs healing.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah, so I work in that field, like unconscious relating, like teaching people the skills, but also helping them to really connect with each other. Because I feel it’s needed, we need to sum this planet right now. Because if we can’t figure out how to go forward together, this is not gonna last long here are a planet to be able for us to live on. So that’s one thing. And then, you know, I love working with leaders and was women leaders because I just feel that deep connectedness to life, where I’m not working on a transcendent level, but more like the imminent. Okay, this life is sacred. How can we as leaders, bring this into the forefront? And not just with some woowoo talk, but really concretely, now, how can we actually lead the people in a way in the right direction that is empowering that is collaborative that is honoring the life force and each so you know, how can we bring this value A very spiritual level down to the ground, like really, and then make an impact. You know, we’ve walked and helped to organize a march, you know, to go against to end sex trafficking for young girls in Oakland just recently. And I just feel that’s where that’s where it needs to go to into our actions. And for everybody, that’s different. What area but for me, this is the darkest pit, the sex trafficking was girls. So this is where I bring my love in and my light in and sometimes it takes, you know, takes a bit of a nerve to do that, because these areas aren’t these areas are not pretty. Yeah. But how do we bring home everything? each other, when we sit with each other, when we relate, whether it’s in a couple are in a big, you know, Congress? across nations? How do we how do we actually find the bridge to peace with each other, and then create the what we need on this world? So for me, it’s like bringing it really down into into form.

Rick Archer: A question came in, which relates to what you’re just saying, this is from Mark Peters in Santa Clara, California. He asks, How do you relate to the rise in global threats like climate change, fierce nationalism, nuclear, nuclear proliferation, etc. Have your awakenings allowed you any deep insights about this? And I just want to add a little bit to his question before you respond. And that is that I’ve always felt that. Oh, Irene says just let you respond. Okay. You go ahead and respond.

Nicola Amadora: I love hearing you do. Well, I saw this a long time ago, it was, again, when I was 18. I saw what was happening in the world and were worried it might go there was still, you know, ways that it could shift and do differently. But we are in this time, we’re everything comes to the edge. Like everything, you either humanity either wakes up now and takes the takes the you know, the wheel through the three S’s and just turns to ship. Or we mean, I don’t

Rick Archer: ship goes down hits the iceberg or something.

Nicola Amadora: Well, we are kind of like an Titanic. Yeah, yeah. We already hit the iceberg. Which is the part that is this is for me, it’s the greatest, the greatest challenge at this moment in time. I know I’m born for that time. And many, many were many people are. It’s, and it is an incredible opportunity right now. Yeah. Because we if if, in my experience was the power and in the genius and intelligence that’s available, when we really connected to the source. It’s unprecedented what we can do.

Rick Archer: I forget what it is I’ve maybe you know, this, I heard someplace that the roots of the word crisis are related to the word opportunity. You know, you know that saying, it’s yes, somehow crisis is opportunity or offers opportunity.

Nicola Amadora: I think it offers a tremendous opportunity. And it’s also there’s a saying that, in the deepest, darkest crisis, it’s when the feminine will rise. We know when the non dual wisdom there is no feminine masculine and yet, there is the feminine force of creation. And she always came in, in the old ancient stories like with door Gara, or Tara, key always comes Kali, she comes in the time of the greatest challenge, when humanity doesn’t know where to go and what to do anymore because it has won against this has run itself into the ground. So I can sense and this is where I’m dedicated to my work is to bring even more to help the feminine to come forth even more not just as the woman but in the men to that deep power of life.

Rick Archer: Having said that, just now what do you feel about the fact that the man who sort of bragged about molesting women got elected even by a majority of women voters? What does that tell us?

Nicola Amadora: Well, it tells us we’re part of the consciousnesses on the planet, I think very clearly, part of humanity is stolen in another age and consciousness stuck. And I think that, for me, at least that doesn’t mean feminine, saying it doesn’t mean woman necessarily the feminine forces in you as well as in me, however, you’re the guy who got I call him the WHO note, the one who’s, who should not be named. I love very well, we have a complete, insane person. And from a very, from a more awake perspective, you look at this person as either this is this one is bringing suffering to the planet, there is no question. And that is sad. However, at the same time, there’s a tremendous opportunity, because he’s doing so many bad things, that he’s waking, literally people up people and it’s in the outrage where you find your love. You know, what people starting take, they even the people usually go to sleep on politics, even they are getting on and starting to wake up and saying, Okay, we’ve got to do something. On one level, on a very, you know, and then non dual level, there’s nothing happening. Yeah. But you know, what we are on planet Earth. And I think we have incarnated for a reason, where it is much more challenging to say, Yes, I have this elimination, and now I’m going to bring it into action. Yeah, this in this world as it is. And this means was, was who should not be named. That’s the time where people need to rise up and stand up.

Rick Archer: Yeah, like this thing he’s just said about on the non dual level, nothing is happening. But obviously, there’s a this point often comes up in these interviews, which is that that’s not the if you’re living being then that’s not the only level on which you reside. It’s one dimension, it’s perhaps the most fundamental dimension. And there’s another dimension in which things are happening, but everything is perfect, just as it is. But then there’s another dimension within which things are happening, and they aren’t perfect. And we need to fix we need to fix them, you know, and so one, not none, none of those three levels kind of negate or obviate the others.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah, I appreciate that. You bring that in. Because that’s why I feel the the spiritual scene as I call it has gotten a little stuck in the field of nothing is happening, everything is perfect as it happens. And sometimes, I perceive it is used as an escape from being involved and engaged to me. You have your awakening now. Now put your hands to work, put your feet in, put your heart in love until it’s like love to the end, no matter what.

Rick Archer: I think a lot of people got kind of tired of the nothing is happening. Everything is perfect. thing, you know? Yeah. And it’s like a lot, a lot more people started talking about embodiment, you know, and that’s that sort of theme. And, you know, let’s just what you’re saying, let’s, let’s bring this into into some kind of practical application.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah. I think, who should not be named is? As disasterous in my opinion, is he is at the same time, he’s such a blessing because he’s just like, Okay, it’s just pushing, it’s it making it so bad that it pushes on, everybody is pulling everybody in the school room, right. And he’s pushing, you can take it as an opportunity to say, Okay, what is true here for me? Can I actually bring myself to do some action in a way that honors and, and really loves life? Yeah,

Rick Archer: the thing I was gonna add to Mark Peters question was just that all these problems, climate change, and nuclear proliferation, all the all the things happening in the world. I’ve always seen that kind of thing as as symptomatic of something deeper. And it’s not just deeper in the sense of economic or, or decisions being made by politicians or anything like that. Those things are reflective of the collective consciousness, which means your consciousness, my consciousness, every 7 billion people, their the quality of their consciousness, taken collectively, sort of expresses itself in a certain quality of society and quality of life and quality of economics and politics and climate and all that stuff. And so it’s really, there’s an interesting consideration, which is, I mean, back in the late 60s, early 70s. There were people like myself who are meditating and who thought that You know, social action and so on was superficial, we should just really change our consciousness. And then the people who are engaged in protests and so on, thought the meditators were lazy, and you know, just sitting on their butts and going into withdrawal. And I think there’s been a sort of a merging now where people feel like you can have both, and you need both, and one without the other is in complete.

Nicola Amadora: That’s exactly, yeah, thank you for bringing that up. It’s like the two wings of the bird to fly. You need your connection, you need to be able to be in the peace, and then the deep centeredness and connectedness and then you need to act because we are making an impact in the world whether, yeah, so meditation doesn’t become a bailout. But also action doesn’t come from a disconnected frantic, like, save the world? Hell, yeah. It’s not nothing, I call it, you know, letting you to nature live through you. And, and impacting the world. Yeah,

Rick Archer: I guess when we’re looking at this, we can think of ourselves as conduits, you know, which is, we could use the word channel. Also, I don’t mean to associate that with channeling that we were talking about earlier, but I mean, don’t you kind of feel like, you know, you, you dip into this source of Divine Wisdom. And then it’s like a sponge that has soaked something up, and you can now go and squeeze it and, you know, near water, some nourish something that needs that nourishment? It kind of comes through you in waves of? Yeah,

Nicola Amadora: yeah, it’s like, and I see it often as I received the waterfall of grace, it floods through me, it fills every salad and nurtures and then it just started to pour it out further. It’s another waterfall flowing down to keep the people to feed the land to. Yeah,

Rick Archer: I mean, how else does the divine get expressed into the world, if not, through the various forms of life that it has created, you know, so we can be very powerful conduits for? Yeah, for various influences. And it’s good to be good to be on the team of the good guys.

Nicola Amadora: We certainly are in a fierce battle right now. But it feel it has to come. It comes from a deep love for recognizing people, the plants to animals, all life. This is one life, but it’s it’s not a concept. It’s deeply felt and experienced, and therefore I love it loves itself. In moments when we learn just when I really wide open, I can experience the whole universe loving itself, all the plants, all the creatures, it may sound funny to you, but it’s making love to unto itself. It’s in a grand dance of in a normal, incredible love affair. And that love when it can be expressed even in the most simplest form as me looking into your eyes with you know, or US relating in a, in a loving way. It has an outlet. And it can it can, it’s starting to circle. It’s a movement. And in that movement, everything is included, there is nothing left out. There is not the Muslim left out and there’s not the you know, even your darkest shaman anger all gets to be included in that love. I mean, that’s not a concept. That’s for me a direct experience. And in that, when that started opening up in me I was I was like, oh my god, the whole earth is making love to itself. It’s in this exquisite, profound, sacred lovemaking all the time.

Rick Archer: Yeah, someone used to say that the whole creation is just the, the self interacting dynamics of consciousness, sort of, there’s nothing but that interacting with itself and through that interaction giving rise to the appearance of all these forms and phenomena.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah. And it’s also extremely vulnerable and intimate, vulnerable and yeah, very it you know, include to humanity or bear humanity is included a lot. Sometimes that consciousness, spiritual talk is so removed from this is the consciousness and here’s your humanity. Yeah. But this is this vessel. This humanity is this utter vulnerability. ality and intimacy is the is it?

Rick Archer: Yeah. You know, I mean, if if it’s true, and it is that, you know, it’s all consciousness and we are one, one person ultimately, that appears one ocean that appears as separate waves and so on, then then everything that is taking place in the world is taking place within us. And, you know, the fact that some what, how many million people are in prison in the United States a larger percentage per capita than any nation in the world by far. And that there’s things like, you know, that came out of the news, Amnesty International just revealed that there’s this prison in Damascus, where 13,000 people have been hanged in recent years and, and all these people have been tortured, and all that stuff. I mean, that kind of thing. We may not be aware of it, you know, these, it might be kind of out of sight, out of mind, that all these people are stuck in those situations, but it’s very much part of our own personal consciousness. It’s happening within me, and within you and within, within all of us and, and if it’s like a malignant cancer that we’re not aware of, or something, but it’s still doing its thing, and it may be spreading, and we’re not going to really be healthy until until that malignancy has been has been cured.

Nicola Amadora: That’s that’s beautifully said. That’s, that’s why I resonate with is this is because I experienced this in my body when you say those things. You feel it I feel it in my whole being. Yeah, because I’m connected right? And how can I then people ask me how can you not how will you not drown in it? Yeah, and there’s all this suffering because we are in a sea of suffering. That’s what the Buddha said. Yeah. However, it’s like this is what a bodhisattva vow comes in. I will walk awake I will I will let that love lift me even till the last has come home. Yeah. Not blind to what is here

Rick Archer: yeah. I remember when I was for a fairly new meditator I had a girlfriend that was going off into heroin addiction and and I was really upset about it and stuff and I spoke to my meditation teacher she said be an ocean and I don’t know if that was totally practical advice in terms of helping my girlfriend I’ve heard that she’s in a in a psychiatric hospital to this day but but somehow that be an ocean phrase always stuck with me. And in terms of having this sort of oceanic capacity to absorb not absorb but to dissolve anything that comes into our awareness and to not be polluted by it. But you know, to be able to dissolve it and continue to be an ocean

Nicola Amadora: and I’m sorry about your girlfriend. Yeah. Must have been painful.

Rick Archer: Yeah, I remember. I was in an encounter group at the time and I told them about what was going on and I just broke down and sobbed for about 15 minutes people were hugging me and I was sobbing. You know, I finally kind of sobered up but it was a painful thing and it because I really wanted her to live a happy life and I could see that the the direction she was going it wasn’t going to work out that way. But mine was going in a different direction and I had to I had to keep going

Nicola Amadora: yeah, you know parting ways. Yeah. In the in the in the ocean. Yeah, that’s the that’s you know what you you just you allowed your heart to break with it.

Rick Archer: Yeah, I did. And it doesn’t happen that often. You know, I’m not the type that just sort of cries easily but about every 10 years something really moves me.

Nicola Amadora: (Laughter) That’s funny. I cry every day.

Rick Archer: I have a friend who does that you know, he I guess I won’t mention his name because he told me that privately but he’s he’s a spiritual teacher whom I’ve interviewed and and very sweet guy and he just says he pretty much cries every day when he watches the news or many many other things and he’s not like some moody, mushy kind of guy. He’s very clear very strong. But he just feels things so deeply and yet he has the capacity to feel them and you know, not be thrown off kilter by the by that.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah, I do. The things touched me very deeply. I cry very easily. I love I laugh very easily. And You know, when I hear of suffering, it hits me very deeply at the same time I let it move, I let it move. It’s like let the ocean wash it with let the ocean tears, wash it through. Because my heart cannot be open, I have nothing to give really. And let’s allows me, you know, the vulnerable, this takes some courage to be vulnerable, but I think he can, you can bring that vulnerability together with the deep rootedness of being one in the ocean. That all washes through, and at the same time, is to us so deeply touched by everything.

Rick Archer: Yeah. This brings up an interesting question, actually. And that is, Can such openness and vulnerability be actually intentionally cultured? Or is it more that some people are wired that way and some people aren’t.

Nicola Amadora: So in my experience in working with people, and then for my own self, too, I you can you can cultivate that. Some people are naturally wired more into the, you know, into that area, but you can definitely cultivate it. It’s, it’s, it just takes a bit courage and it takes some skillful means to be able to open it and to allow it to. And then, but you definitely can. No question. Yeah.

Rick Archer: And another question related to that is, if a person doesn’t have the inner strength, maybe, maybe not being so open is, is a useful protective mechanism, you know, because they’re just gonna really be overwhelmed by things. Yeah. So that you need to have a certain Foundation, right? In order to do Yeah,

Nicola Amadora: you need you have, you have to have a solid, you know, fairly solid foundation, not perfect, but you have to have a foundation, you know, that’s grounded more spiritually. But also, you got to have a bit of a healthy ego in place to, like, in order to let it melt. Yeah.

Rick Archer: Yeah. Now, that’s an interesting point, too. I mean, so many things we could talk about. But some people say, Well, get rid of ego, destroy your ego. But there are definitely certain spiritual traditions say, yeah, that that may come at some point. But first, you have to build it up and make sure it’s, you know, really a healthy one, before you can talk about going beyond it.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah. And for vulnerability, my my senses, in order to be able to be really vulnerable, you have to develop a capacity to be fully present, to be really present, and to also be rooted in your body. Otherwise, you walk around in the street. Oh, my God, this is so did. You’ve seen people? Yeah, I

Rick Archer: mean, I’ve seen people that I can’t go into WalMart, it was overwhelming.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah, for me, it’s like I have this. I see it as the lotus flower yet. The open heart, it’s a lotus flower, but it has its roots really deep in the earth in the mud. And then when you really solid ground, you know, like COVID, you know, really grounded here. In that what is life sustaining? That holds me that gives me a normal strength and feel like I’m a tree. You know, when I walk into WalMart, I still feel open. I actually don’t walk into Walmart.

Rick Archer: Use one of those little motorized carts, right.

Nicola Amadora: I don’t like that store. Because, you know, but you know, it sells?

Rick Archer: To me, you know that stuff from China and everything. But that’s just a case in point.

Nicola Amadora: But yeah, that’s a good question, because that’s what’s feared so much, but I feel the vulnerability is actually your entrance to your true nature.

Rick Archer: Would you tell me back to the how of it? Would you kind of say that? And some people actually criticize me for being such a proponent of practice, because I myself am a practice. And they say, you know, but do you feel like that there is on this point we’re making about being strong enough to be open strong enough to be vulnerable, that it’s not just gonna hit you on the head one of these days, it’s more like some kind of regular practice of some sort on a daily basis is going to help the culture.

Nicola Amadora: Yes, yes. It does help the culture and when you sit every day, and you actually practice meditation, you practice and that’s rootedness not a transcendent meditation. I wouldn’t say that will help you with not transcendence meditation, that doesn’t help that you need to have a practice that’s, that helps you to be in your body that helps you to allows you to be there with all your feelings that are arising and feel them without getting confused. Lately entangled in a story, you need to be able to really let that awareness expand in, you know, big present, really, these are these are tools actually

Rick Archer: to there’s also a time for transcendence, you know, I mean, yes, kind of the, there’s a time to dip the bucket into the well, and there’s a time to pull it out and, you know, use the water well, or there’s other analogies you could use to, but there’s a time to take the cloth, dip it into the colored dye, and there’s a time to bleach it in the sun. So it’s absolutely right. But But I hear you in terms of transcendence being used as a sort of an escape, and you tried to just keep take continual refuge there without integration. You know? Yeah, that’s not healthy.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah. And that vulnerability is so often is, is feared the most. Because we’ve gotten hurt there earlier. And the imprint is if I’m open, I will be hurt. It’s a very simple story. And the mind goes on survival plane and says, I will never go there. I will never have that happen again. And then if you if you start cultivating, you are much more you know, centered in yourself, then you can actually be vulnerable, allow yourself to be open and let the arrow move through you. You will feel pain, but you will not suffer. And that’s something to learn, you know, where you’re not holding on to that arrow that just hit you. Somebody said something not nice to you in when you walk or somebody betrayed you or left you. Yeah. i For me, when I had my own experiences of, you know, betrayals, I was like, How can I keep my heart open? Even with that? It seemed insane. My mindset closed down. What are you how are you doing? And there was this deeper commitment in me. Even with this, I shall stay open.

Rick Archer: Yeah, I mean, that was that example of when your husband at the time squandered all the money of the organization in the stock market and the whole thing collapse? Your response was to go and get as open as possible up on Mount Shasta,

Nicola Amadora: that, that took all my deepest commitment that if I didn’t love that, the vow to truth, or to love, I would never be able to do that. Yeah, it’s and to me, that enabled me to say, Okay, open up even to this, and even wider. What I found though, Rick was, the beauty of it was, it was excruciating, painful, but once I let it open, I let myself open through it. There was only more love that I found. Yeah, that was the beauty of it. So the pain didn’t become so frightening anymore to me.

Rick Archer: Well, geez, I mean, you’d face down an anaconda. I mean, after that, everything is?

Nicola Amadora: Yeah, yeah, well, and a lot of the trails and, you know, heartaches and you know, pains, left and right. And I was like, the path is full of sorts of like, when does this end and I just, I didn’t end it had to do with me turning towards it and fully, fully open to it. And in that moment, I just felt okay. I can feel all the pain and I just, it doesn’t knock me out anymore. It doesn’t. It doesn’t do anything other than I open to greater love.

Rick Archer: Yeah. Kind of like, welcome to Life on Earth. Yep. There’s always gonna be stuff like this. Let the party begin. So before we can, before we wrap up and talk about, you know, what your current teaching activity and all that stuff is, is there anything else that along the lines of your life story that you want to comment on or mention?

Nicola Amadora: I think there’s only I think to say that when the stripping happens in my life it was there was in my in my mind was this is wrong, this is not supposed to happen. And I would say it might be just for many people, it just might be this is part of the awakening process, that there’s a stripping and for me, it went as far as stripping me of, you know, deeply involved with the many different spiritual traditions. It’s true. I couldn’t go to one more Sufi dance. I couldn’t do Amar. I couldn’t Nothing of this anymore. Like I have to, I was completely thrown into myself on my own. I didn’t. And I couldn’t even read one more spiritual book. I had to let go of all of it, and nothing of it made sense no more. And it was that feeling of, okay, even the concepts, even the traditions, even the forms, everything is taken, what is left when the fire is burned? And that’s when I just came to this. It’s just a lot of you know, that. Just that beautiful. Love that’s there.

Rick Archer: Nice. And do you still feel that way? Like, you just feel like you don’t need to go to anything or want to go to anything. You’re just content in the love that’s there.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah, I you know, there was in and out of residing in it, and then leaving it like this. I just dance. We’re so I just had it, it was gone. Where did you go with this love? So I had to do this many times. You know, and sometimes it goes still in and out. It’s, but it’s so much clearer, much clearer. Yeah.

Rick Archer: I think everybody ever experiences that things come and go. And they and in the coming and going they get more and more kind of stabilized. Yeah, that’s it.

Nicola Amadora: Exactly. Yeah.

Rick Archer: Alrighty, so you wrote a book, nothing but love some nice poetry. Very roomy, like, and you’re working on a couple other books, which aren’t published yet. Right? But they will. And then you live out there in Berkeley. So people obviously are watching this interview from all over the world. What can they do? If they want to connect with you? How can you work with them.

Nicola Amadora: So what I do is I teach retreats, spiritual retreats in different places, and some of them where I’m invited to. I’ve done that for pots. 30 years now. 25 years, I teach also leadership, and relating trainings more on a conscious level how to do it. And I so they can actually, they can see it on my website, on their events, what’s coming up, and if people want me to come to the area that can just contact me. And then I work with individuals and couples on Skype. And in person here in the Bay Area, mainly. So, yep, um, my books, one of them is called Kiss by fire. And the other one is called chameleon with nature stories from the wild. When will those be published? Probably by the end of the year. Okay. Great. Yeah. So I will let them know. Yeah. And I do satsangs on at the moment, I do it much more online. Yeah. So I have a committed group. And then, you know, people can join to that as well.

Rick Archer: Okay. And you probably have an email signup thing on your website. So if people want to be notified of when your book is published, or whatever, they can do that. Yeah.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah. Yeah. Or they can just sign up. I don’t write too many newsletters. I don’t want to inundate people once in a while, once in a while, and they can just sign up and, and we also do some sacred activism, work here. Great. That’s one of the leaders in the field there. Cool.

Rick Archer: Great, well, I really enjoyed this. I think people watching will have enjoyed it. Also. Any kind of final words you want to say before we conclude?

Nicola Amadora: Well, what I want to say is that to keep returning to your own being I know this is these are old words, and, but keep feeling. Feel what’s in your heart here. And follow that. And I don’t mean that in a cliche way. I mean that in a really deep way. Just keep coming back to it and let let others touch you. Let touch others we really needed in this time. Just stand up and speak out. light that fire wherever you go.

Rick Archer: Great. Well, thank you. So I’ve been speaking with Nicola Amadora. And, as always, they’ll have a page on batgap.com for this interview, and with a bunch of information about her and linked links to her website and her book. And later on, you know, like later in the year when you publish your other books, let me know and I can add links to those on your page. And as most of you know who are watching this, this is an ongoing series. Next week, I’ll be speaking with a gentleman named Dwayne Elgin. whom I find very interesting. And we we schedule several months in advance, there’s an upcoming interviews page on BatGap, where you can see the people we have scheduled, and hope to be doing this for many years to come. There’s another page on BatGap, you might want to check out, which is just called out of glance. And if you just go there, you’ll see a list of all the main features on the site, things you can sign up for do or read or whatever. So do that if you’d like. And guess that’s it. Yeah, I wanted

Nicola Amadora: to say thank you, to you, my message was more for the people who are watching it that to you, I want to say thank you, you’re doing such a beautiful job, beautiful work that you making available, and it will, like I mentioned in the email, it will help many people to find their way in this jungle.

Rick Archer: Yeah, well, I really enjoy it. And it’s not like some big sacrifice or anything. It’s like I do this, you know, for all my life. I really love doing this. In fact, I got a email from a guy the other day who had been some kind of a psychotherapist or something in Chicago. And he said as a result of BatGap He’s sold his practice, which was like this 3000 square foot office space that had all these different therapists in it and, and gave away all his belongings and moved to India. He said, so thank you that’s wonderful. Nice to be disrupting people’s lives like that, you know?

Nicola Amadora: It’s wonderful to hear such stories that that there’s many of those stories, it would be nice to have a page on your website to write you know, what was your what, you know, what impact?

Rick Archer: Well, you do have a page, we have a Testimonials page. And there’s a lot of stories like that. So if you feel like it, if people can watch, look, check out that Testimonials page and read some of them.

Nicola Amadora: Yeah, and your, your questions are really, I just want to honor you. And yeah, just appreciate you for the depth of questions you’re asking.

Rick Archer: Well, thanks. You know, I always have this funny feeling after interviews that it could have been deeper could have been better. I didn’t really do justice to the person. I kind of beat myself up a little bit. But um, some are other people enjoy this. And I

Nicola Amadora: really Yeah, I can sense it’s really good. We are also in a nice flow with each other. Yeah. Yeah. No, it was beautiful. I really appreciated your comments as well. To the several, you know your perspective in it.

Rick Archer: Thanks. Okay. Well, thanks. Thank you, Nicola, and thanks to those who’ve been listening or watching. And I’ll see you next week. And I’m actually going to put up another one. This Thursday, which was recorded at the science and non duality conference last October, I finally got it got permission to go ahead and post that that’ll be a group conversation with Locke, Kelly mukti, who is Adi Shanti, his wife and Francis Bennett. All about the heart, sutra and Buddhism, the Form is emptiness, emptiness is form. So that’ll be going up Thursday, and then next weekend, as I mentioned, Duane algen. So thanks for listening watching. Thanks again. Nicola. We’ll see you all next week.