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RICK: Welcome to Buddha at the Gas Pump. My name is Rick Archer, Buddha at the Gas Pump is an ongoing series of interviews with spiritually Awakening people, we’ve done well over 500 of them now. And if this is new to you, if you haven’t seen one before, go to bat gap comm bat gap. And look under the past interviews menu, where you’ll find all the previous ones archived in various ways. This program is made possible through the support of appreciative listeners and viewers. So if you appreciate it, and would like to help support it, there’s a PayPal button on every page of bat gap calm. My guest today is Ingrid Honkala. PhD. Welcome, Ingrid.
INGRID: Thanks so much, Ray. Thanks for having me here is just such an honor.
RICK: Happy to like to have you and I read your whole book this past week, in titled A brightly guided life how scientists learn to hear her inner wisdom. And it’s quite a book and we’ll be talking about a lot of the stuff that you wrote about in that book during this interview, and a few things you didn’t write about, because I had a few questions as I read it, which I still have. But let me let me just say a few things about you quickly. Ingrid was born in Bogota, Colombia. And she had a near death experience when she was nearly three years old, from drowning in a tank of cold water. It’s good thing it was cold. By the way, you know that, don’t you? I mean, you don’t want to drown in warm water because your brain doesn’t last very long. But cold water people have lasted up to half an hour and then revived and then okay. So anyways, it’s 1600 feet in Bogota. So that’s where the water was called. Ingrid now during this experience, and she’ll be telling us in detail she had, she became aware of other dimensions of life and began to perceive Beings of Light. And they have she’s been in touch with them on and off throughout her life ever since. And they have helped her in various ways, which we’ll also discuss. Ingrid had a whole lot of challenges. Colombia was a country at war as she was growing up there. And she went through all sorts of things, which we’ll describe in some detail. But she ended up getting a PhD. And would you say oceanography, or is it more specific?
INGRID: Yeah, mindset to be more specific mind science says with emphasis in biological oceanography. Okay. Marine
RICK: Sciences. Yeah, yeah. And she’s worked at NASA. She’s traveled all over the world and studied all kinds of interesting things. And, and her life has also had a profound spiritual track to it as, as she developed this professional track. Alrighty, so there’s a lot more to the bio, but let’s just get into our conversation and details will come out as we go. Let’s do that. Alright, so it seems like the best place to start is this near death experience story, which I’m sure you’ve told 1000 times, but people listening to this probably haven’t heard it. So let’s start with that.
INGRID: Yes, read. Thanks. Yeah, that like you mentioned, I live in Bogota at the time and I live with my parents and two of my sisters at the time and it was normal. Those days in Colombia to Have a Maid leaving in the house. So my parents will leave for work. They left us at the care of this lady and when they will go out she didn’t even pay attention to us. So early one morning, my oldest sister who was close to four, I was close to three decided ah, let’s go play. And there was a patio at the back of the house. We went to the patio was very early around six in the morning 630 And then in this patio, there was a tank and the purpose of the stand was 400 Washing clothes. Back in the day we didn’t have a washing machine. So this tank was for to collect water it held about 900 gallons of water. And next to the tank there was a flat surface for scrubbing. So we grabbed couple of stools, my sister climb the tank and she sat on the flat surface so she was a little bit safer compared with me. I went to the other side. It was a thing age, and being a child, what is the danger, so I’m living very precariously in this tank. She grabbed the ball. And she thought our idea was to play Cash across the tank. So she grabbed a ball, she thought, she threw the ball on me. And at that moment, she didn’t apply enough force. And the wall fell in the water. And I thought I could grab it, what is the problem, I leaned forward to try to grab the ball and you roll on the surface of the water. And then I fell into the tank. Like you mentioned that probably the temperature in this tank was about 34 degrees Fahrenheit, the water was fried it called. So that was the first thing was the feeling of like, these water is cold. And then after that was that sense, rake of like, why I cannot breathe. I have never been in a pool, we didn’t have a laptop. So I did not have idea that if you fall in water, you drowned you. I didn’t know this. So I’m now in this state of absolute horror, why I cannot break. And then I just sunk into the tank. And when I am in desperate attempt to just try to get out of these water didn’t know how to swim. I want just like that, from this state of complete terror, to just like, ah, one of absolute peace. I didn’t have to fight anymore. I didn’t need to breed. I didn’t need to escape from this time. It was like, wow, I didn’t have idea what was happening. But I was feeling incredibly well. And then I always like to put like, describe some little contrast that happened there. Because one thing is the stand was entirely made of cement, he had a roof. So the area in the town was very dark. So the last thing I saw red with my eyes open was like the darkness of the space. And then in just like a flash, a light came from below. And these lie was like the light of a candle. But he was able to illuminate the whole watery surrounding. And now I’m like, wow, there’s light.
INGRID: The next thing, the next incredible contrast was that I live in a house, I was very noisy, we have dogs, birds, causes my sister. So there was always noise. And the last thing I also heard before I went to the state of peace was my heart. Imagine this care, my heart was pounding in my chest, like the anxiety I could hear in my head, boom, boom, boom. And he went silent. There was the state of I just experience up salute, silence, and is what I what I call this silence behind the silence. Because never in my life after that, I could experience that. And I wanted that silence regulated, I will hide in closets, chapels, whatever it was to find that silence. So that was the other thing. And this moment I am mesmerized by this feels so good. And then I started to see bubbles suspended in the water. And these bubbles were surrounded by light. And it was by looking these bubbles on chasing the bubbles that I turn around. And then I saw a body suspended in the water. And is when incredibly I just at the moment had the realization that clarity that Oh, that’s my body. I didn’t even feel afraid. And really it was the sense like, oh, this already had happened. I was familiar with this situation like Oh, I already like I already had change bodies many times I experienced like the eternity of who I was.
RICK: Now, let me interrupt you right here. This is interesting. So you’re not even three years old. And you’re you’re describing this now with your adult mind. But you’re describing things that a two or three year old could hardly conceive of was particularly this last thing you said that you had the realization that you have changed bodies, many times you’re alluding to reincarnation. So there’s two interesting things here. One is that you would be able to entertain such a concept as in reincarnation. And the other is that what struck me throughout that strikes me throughout this whole story is that you remember it so vividly as if it happened yesterday, even though happened maybe almost 40 something years ago. So what do you say to those things?
INGRID: You know, read, that’s incredible, because that’s the clarity I have about this experience. And to the point that even when I mentioned it, and I wrote it on the book, even when we saw that the balls in the patio, I can even have memory of the color of the ball and the, it had like high relief letters.
RICK: They call it embossed. Yeah, I’m boss. And
INGRID: I could even remember the drawings that were next to each letter. It’s like how clear the seas in my mind. And when I had that, that clarity of like, even seeing like, wow, this already happened. It was the sense of I am familiar with this. And I cannot explain how I knew these people. And even when we talk about the After Effects, when I came back, I already came back with clarity. Are you in combat like a child that hard on you that
RICK: came back, like a wise person all of a sudden,
INGRID: now? Yes. So how I knew these things I couldn’t explain. But even even again, like later in the experience, when when I join or when I was in this realm of the libraries, again, the sense of familiarity, I already have been here. I already have experience here. I’m just coming back home. So yeah, this whole experience. And again, that’s why I also like to bring all the points of contrast, because I think that’s what also made these experience. So difficult. Oh, I guess impossible to forget. Because there were so many things that I experienced that broad that extreme contrast, and the other one that I am about to mention, is when I saw that body rig, and I was born as a very sick child. And I spent the almost the first three years of my life feeling unwell. So up to this point of my life, I didn’t even know how to feel well meant for Ingrid as as a three year old. And now I am in experiencing the sense of absolute well being. Like, I’m feeling so well that wow, look at the decisions. Look at the clarity how I could even make these decision with, with so with the knowing that I could make it I just look at the body. And I’m like, I’m not going back there.
RICK: Yeah. And
INGRID: you look at the body and unlike why I want to be in that body. And I feel so well that this is the other part that I said sometimes we will ask why a child will be born sake, why these things could happen. And for me in in my own experience. I cannot talk for other people, but that brung me at that moment that or the memory of holding that point of contrast, was to feel unwell. And what was to feel so well.
RICK: It’s interesting that a person can feel well, when they don’t even have a body. It makes you wonder, like what do we what is it that we feel are our you know, what are we feeling with if we don’t have a body? Yeah, and
INGRID: you know what, I have thought about that right? Like, and even when I look people that are very sick with significance or whatever it is, and you go to sleep, how’s it possible that you can even rest if your body’s in so much pain, but you go to sleep and you disconnect and this is these are good just to put that analogy does how it feels is like you slept pretty much at that moment, your body or the concept or whatever it is your body separates and you don’t feel you don’t have later actually when I came back, Rick, I would have that question for years I said how could I have seen my body lifeless? If I was still alive? more alive than ever How is it possible for you
RICK: not only saw your body in the tank but as I’m sure you’re about to tell us you saw you went traveled around a little bit and saw other people
INGRID: make these amazing because and here’s what validates also the whole experience even more because at that moment like I said, I just saw the body of no going back there turn around and I started to see flowers that were blooming from nowhere. And this is this is amazing because now you think about these something I think now I didn’t think it back there but I’m like, what happened with dimension? how big these flowers were that I was picked up by flowers. See? So these are things I think now of course by then I just was picked up by flowers and he was this is great.
RICK: During the flowers, were picking you up there you were sitting on them.
INGRID: Yes, yes. Okay, so, um, who was being picked up? I don’t know, see I, if I think about it, now I can create the ideas, but at the time I just didn’t. I’m just like now being carried by flowers. So wow, so good. And I put the analogy like is going back to the womb, because again, it was that sense of like, Ah, I don’t have to do anything. I’m just being carried. And then I am just there in just the state of just feeling so happy joy for good. And then in just a flash like that. I appear in the mate room. And I’m like floating about her bed. And I’m looking at her. And this is again, look at look at how incredible are these memories free that I can even remember the soap opera, she was listening in the radio. And she was completely unaware that I was there. And I’m like, oh, that’s Maria. Nothing. So from there in again, just a flash. I appear in my mom’s way. My mom’s was walking. At the time. She didn’t have a car. And she had to walk her boss to stop and he was a big neighborhood. And I appeal. And again, I am floating like, above her. And the moment rate and she was actually walking. She could. There’s more a story behind, but she just got this new job. So imagine that decision she had to make at this moment. If she doesn’t want to be late for that job or anything. She would not have turned around. But at that moment when I said oh, that’s mom. She’s thought she did not hesitate. She just stopped. And she knew she knew something was happening at home. Yeah. She turned around and started to run back home.
RICK: How far was she from the home?
INGRID: He was firing. It was about 10 minutes walking. Wow. So five, five minutes running maybe? Yeah, so we don’t know how long that was under the water. But yeah, maybe I’ll five minutes. And she started to run. And I just looked at her. And I’m like, oh, and at that moment. It’s like I raised my eye. I saved my head because I didn’t have the concept that I wasn’t I raised my vision and I saw a dog and I love animals so it was like at the end of a street and in shows like that I was with the dog so at that moment I turned my head and I look a tree and now I am with the tree and on my wall so I started to play this game of going places that the dog sense
RICK: your presence. I don’t know. And sometimes animals do see subtle things you know?
INGRID: They do they do but no at that moment I was just it was so fast rake it was like I turned my head saw a tree and now I’m with the tree so I’m like I just started to play this game of going places like this is fun. Then from there everything in these experiences will happen in like in a second like in a flash now just like that are you appearing around and he was made of pure intense shiny light. And it was the first time rake in those almost three years of my life that I have this sense the feeling the I am home. I have to also tell you something, why did I felt this feeling of home one I was burning out. My like I mentioned you my body was always unwell to my parents were forced to married so it’s not really a very good situation happening a home they will leave their mate was very abusive person. So the situation at home was very hard. And now I am in this realm of the library. Everything falls well fell well when I fell Welcome. I am home. And I put the analogy for me was the sense of like, say in the morning I went to school, or I left home or I went somewhere and I am back but he’s no like even three years had passed. It was the sense of I am back home in this just happened. So again that sense of familiarity kept repeating. And you asked me I don’t know how I knew these things, but he was that clear. And
RICK: then now was there anything in that light that you could perceive? It was just sort of like
INGRID: it was only live but that was feeling that was the sense I was not alone for So the sense like I, again, I work with analogies, the sense that you get home and you know, your parents, your family, your wife is somewhere in the house. And so I felt welcome. That was the feeling in being welcome. And then at that moment, although I saw the body in the water, and I knew I was my body, I did not have that realization, that I am not that. So look at how far these weaponry because he went to knowing at the moment, I am not that. So I look at myself. And I realize myself as a beam of light, I am a beam of light. And then I started to have that sense of like, just this nice sense of well being amplified, like 10 times. So it was the sense of like, wow, I’m part of all this I there was no sense of again I am that body, I am this I am that. And then I felt that sense even today, I could just say with all the learnings, all the teachings I experienced, and I experienced it many times throughout my life, the sense of nothingness. What I mean with this there was no presence of sound of color of meaning of concept of nothing I knew body. Nothing out. There was nothing great.
RICK: Your consciousness all by itself. Yes,
INGRID: yeah, pure consciousness. And I am in this nothingness state when some people get very scared when I say nothing. But I feel are now I know with all the other experiences that at the same time is the state of wholeness exists, just Sure. Expansion you feel is what we call bliss, I guess. And then at that moment, my mom arrived home. And this is the other incredible thing rich, she knew exactly where to go. And she really, we lived in a big house. And she directed herself to the back of the house. This is the other thing I set up on my mom, she was a very, very intuitive woman. And I said to people, but it’s not just the intuition is that you learn to hear your own intuition. Yeah. I was always like that.
RICK: And she told me later that she could see auras and things like that to
INGRID: spirits and all that. So she, she was very little, she was very sensitive. She always was all her life. So and she went to the patio. And this is a question that people asked me, my sister was still there. And people asked me why your sister didn’t go talk to the maid. What happened was that this lady was very abusive. She thought we were afraid of her. So look what kids do fear of reprisal. She, she didn’t go to the friend, she’d get in trouble or something. Exactly. And she was just trying to get me out of the water. But she was too little. And the time was deep. So my mom got there to my sister said, Ingrid is there and I cannot get to her. My mom were with children. She had some training. My mom always wanted to be a doctor. In reality, she read a lot, any training that was out there available, she will take and she had some trainings on how to do some CPR. I don’t even know how that training was at the time. But she went into the water, she got me out and she started to do anything she knew to revive me. And at that moment, Rick, I was so disconnected from this reality. I did not feel anything. There was nothing to do with this body with this physical reality. But again, like everything in this experience, I felt like that in the past that I had jumped from the tallest building in the world. And there was nothing I could do. I didn’t nobody asked me you want to go back or nothing like that happened for me was like, you go. And I felt like I was being vacuum. Like I was being pulled. And it was the sense like if you joined from from ground zero and you feel the vacuum. And now there’s nothing I could do. And I knew I was back in the body when all the feelings of the heaviness there. I am not free. I feel that I’m comfortable feelings of the body, the pain, the coldness, the coldness is something even up to today. I could never take away from that. I would like shake away. It’s like, oh, and then now it’s when the hard time came, right because I didn’t want to be back.
RICK: Yeah, you know, I can’t think of a single near death experience. And I’ve read and talk to so many people who whoever said, oh boy, I’m good. Let’s go back to my body. It was, it was all sort of got I’m out of there, you know, I don’t want to go back and then somebody in some cases there would actually be a conversation where some you know guide or being of light or something would would say no, sorry, you have to go back or are they sometimes they give them a choice like okay, well you can stay but how about your daughter? You know, how about your kids? And they then they think, Okay, I’ll go back. But it was always reluctantly.
INGRID: Yes, I guess at that point, because I didn’t have that strong attachment with my parents either with this reality with my body. I was not asking anything. Like your back has
RICK: given any thought I’m sure you have over the years to what it is that actually separates from the physical body and enables us to have experiences once the physical body is incapacitated or even dead.
INGRID: What is that given? I think our our consciousness? Yeah, we are. Rick, I have experiencing things that are incredible. I one day I woke up in my bedroom, I do I meditate all my life. I for me meditation is I say, it’s not a doing it’s a way of being. To me, I am in that state. I woke up three in the morning. One day I wake up and I sit in my bed. And I was bigger than the room itself. I was huge. Rita was huge, so huge that I couldn’t even feed in the bathroom. And I even heard the words grandioso. Like, oh, I know. And I have another one that I experienced, which shows that we are multi dimensional beings. And for you to splain this one is a little bit difficult. So I have to use analogies as an oceanographer. I use the ocean as an analogy. But one time I went to sleep break, and I’m in this deep sleep. And I heard a bell. Clink clinking, clinking. So to give an example with the ocean, the analogy next to it say that, at that moment, I woke up and I was at the very, very deep part of the ocean. How do I know because I woke up, I woke up feeling completely I’m awake. Because I heard this bell. And I’m like, Whoa, what was that bell? And then I heard the bell again, clean glinting thing, and I woke up again. And what, what? What, how. And then I hit the bell again, clean, clean, clean, clean, and I woke up again, one day. And in all these times I woke up I did not have any concept idea thought connection with what we call Ingrid. So if I put you there ocean, I didn’t have connection with the waves on the surface. It was like the deadness of of who I am. And this bill had to sound around five times before I arrived to what I call the thermocline. Where you can feel that there’s okay. The disturbance what is happening in the layers, the first layers of the ocean and I just like oh, oh, there’s something something that is called Ingrid. And I heard the bell again, clean, clean, clean aroma. Oh, yeah, there’s there’s an Ingrid thing. There’s an angry thing, everything. And then I heard for the last time he was six or seven times right when I am finally. Wow. Yes, I’m here. This is the bed. My husband is wow. Yeah. So it’s when I realized with that clarity, we are multi dimensional beings. And we’re leaving at all this states of being.
RICK: Yeah. Yeah, very true. I’ve had some experiences like that too. But I won’t go into
RICK: just all kinds of interesting things. But yeah, a lot of people have. And, you know, I think that we all know it on some level, even even the most ardent atheist or materialist or skeptic. We have to have some kind of deep, innate sense that there’s so much more to life then we’re experiencing such greater depth such greater profundity. It can never be entirely blotted out, don’t you think?
INGRID: It cannot even even when you ask me No, this is what made me also see children and think about children with completely different eyes because of course, at the moment we see the child and the child comes with and now is going to be conditioned but what we know but when I had my new that experience that you asked me how I was aware of seeing myself in eternity and worrying different shells like I call it is because I came back returned now I had an awareness I didn’t know how before. And when I look on my body, these body I will iron no This child
RICK: and so you didn’t forget that did you? I mean, you know you are a little three year old four year old five year old and you just knew is, you know, this is not me.
INGRID: Right and I will look at my parents, so that was hard too because you will think what is the childhood her parents but I had some sort of disconnection at the level of I knew you’re not just my biological I know you’re not this I felt them as my equal I could relate with other children because i i Look at that people reckon I’ll be like what is happening with these people? They don’t know anything. To me they’re like, like, what is non so I came already with that awareness and not just with with knowing I am more than this body I am no this I will look at myself in the mirror Rick and I said that’s not who I am. That is not my name. But I would just say I should not be here because I just really want to be here. And my mom what can you do with a child like that? It’s just my mom just tried to say you’re beautiful don’t think these way be grateful we go whatever but what do you do? And then I started to feel a very angry I didn’t want to eat I didn’t want to even be touched by people. I didn’t want to be here right? Because I just for me is like this is what is happening. Why I am here.
RICK: It’s not your home you you had gone home and all sudden you’re not home anymore. Right? As
INGRID: Reagan now this is the other incredible thing all the validation what happened in this experience? Now I came back and I had the abilities of I was able to read ride, wrestled mathematical problems put together complex puzzles, to think and
RICK: to say that I mean, how much of a jump in your ability was there? And did you go from like, usually people who are under three? Can’t read it. All? Right. Did you all of a sudden, right then next next few days, start reading and writing?
INGRID: Yeah, but it wasn’t like, oh, like,
RICK: it wasn’t Shakespeare it was. Yeah, something was more like
INGRID: they will show and you know what happened? Read my, you know how children don’t develop. And for my mom, that was great, because she was a teacher that abstract ability until later on? Yeah. Then I already had it. Once I came back. So for me, I will see numbers. And if I can do that, for the rest of my life, I could just see patterns, I could see how the words work, I could see how everything worked. And then I will just say to my mom and later in school when I joined a school he was a problem because they didn’t have a culture of children like me. And for the teacher is like if you know everything you sit in that corner and let us be because you know answers right away, right? Oh, yeah. So it was for me a school was stupid. So I was also cannot my mom said she never met anybody more revalues than me.
RICK: It’s funny, nice to have a girlfriend like 50 years ago who was a school teacher. And she there was a kid in her class who I was she was always telling me about, oh, this kid is such a problem. Oh, man, you know, what am I gonna do with them. And they were thinking of holding him back a grade or something. And then somehow they figured out that the problem was that he was actually much too smart for that class. And so they skipped them ahead of Grade A grade. And then all of a sudden, all the problems went away, you know, he was more challenged, he wasn’t bored, and he was able to fit right in.
INGRID: Yeah, so that’s the problem when we see everybody else, that all of us have to do things the same way. Yeah. And I experienced that myself. So I have problems at school because of that. And and for me, read for me was the sense same thing I happen to remind you that experience was the sense I am not learning the same so I’m just remembering. I’m just remembering I’m just remembering. So that now was incredible. So imagine a little child also talking to the parents subjects. Of course I also didn’t have the language to spread and we made it so hard. Because how I could tell them I am experiencing these things. And there was not their understanding either. So if I would tell them I see things I heard things i whatever it is they they just didn’t understand what was happening. And there’s the other thing though, Greg, this is a funny thing this is I always say to people that after my new that experience is like the door never closed because I can have in our body experiences communicating with beings of light all these then no longer go there being so light said to me. Of course they don’t never close because there is no door. Yeah. So I would like oh, yeah, well we call the kingdom or having consciousness, whatever we want. whatever we want to call it is what we are. We are that consciousness, we are the light. So we are the ones due to conditioning due to whatever is cool parents ancestors, we are the ones that close that door, we use the analogy of the sun, the sun is always shining, we’re the one that closed the shutter.
RICK: You’ve referred to Beings of Light several times, but you haven’t really told us yet how the beings of light experience began, was it actually in the tank, you began to see beings of light or later on once you were resuscitated, or what?
INGRID: No, it was later on. After like, set you after my new that experience I kept. I didn’t even know anything about Ottawa experiences, of course, but the concept I didn’t have but that has started to happen. That’s how we know it now. That’s how I know because I will close my eyes. And I will just start experiencing movements Rick, I have never experienced here changes in vibration, frequencies. Colors sounds I have never hear see experience here. And it was kind of scary. But I will go to the realm of the light again. so on. So it no matter if all these things kind of shocking, scary, I want it to be in that realm of the light. And you can anytime you wanted. Not just when I went to sleep, Oh, okay. So,
RICK: so yes. But then later on, you learn to meditate. And maybe that became more voluntary. But in any case, you’re saying that when you were a little kid, it would be when you started going to sleep that this happened?
INGRID: Yes, these would happen. And then, of course after these because it felt so well. I wanted to sleep more. Yes. And then what happened is in one of these journeys, one day, Rick, I used I just saw a star light figures that were shining everywhere. It’s like if i i explain how it is, like if you’re outside looking at the stars, but instead of seeing a black universe is with all light, and the lights were shining in all different colors, all different colors everywhere, like to the infinite Am I so now imagine I wanted to live forever. And then in one of these journeys, I one of these lights shaped itself into human form. And he was shining in gold, pure gold light. And
RICK: let me ask you here, so you were you were going to sleep but you weren’t asleep yet. This wasn’t a dream. You were somewhere in between. You’re just settling in, and then you started having this experience.
INGRID: Yes, yes. So it was a sense, I will start closing my eyes and the changes. Yeah. Speed sound when I would appear there.
RICK: And then when it’s had a human form this first one was it like, kind of very dreamlike and indistinct or was it very clear? Like you could see eyes nose, you know, various features?
INGRID: No, no, just their shape the shape? Okay. It shaped kind of to show me I am like you so it was the shape of these beam? Yeah. And it touched me. Right. And when it touched me when I have that the clear or the knowing of my head in my head came you are a beam of light. So these were some of
RICK: the knowing was that you were one or that was one
INGRID: that he is one because I saw myself as a beam of light during the new that experience. He was there knowing we are the same.
RICK: Okay, it takes one to know one as they say.
INGRID: Yes. And i That day I snapped away. But guess what happened? Of course, my parents tell the other lady to go because she almost led me drawn. They hire a new one. But this one also did it. I mean, if a kid is leaping, you don’t have to take care of the child. So she was good that I was sleeping. So what started to happen is I wanted to take naps, I wanted to sleep all the time. So I will just go to sleep because I wanted to be there. But is now that I understand of course balance is needed at the moment. I didn’t think about that, but I couldn’t live forever. So it’s one I understand why I started to see them here one day I was taking a shower Rachel having oh this is really really good shower. When a beam of light that was shining in bright blue, it was this bright blue intense light it shone in the bathroom and now the beams of light are here. And now after that I started to see them everywhere. And this is one thing people people ask me like how, how you see them how you hit them at the beginning, but now they really didn’t need to shape into anything. I just knew. So I just saw that the lights shining. And when I would look at them, and I later I will say when I started to hear voice, but if they would talk or they will communicate with me, it didn’t matter who it was I knew who was talking. So I didn’t have to see a voice. I didn’t have to hear expression. I just knew I knew who was talking.
RICK: Let me ask you a couple of mundane questions just to make this more real for me and other people. So I got the impression from what you just said that it didn’t really matter whether your eyes were open or closed. You could it wasn’t really a matter of your physical eyes. If it were even pitch dark. You could have seen them, right?
INGRID: Yes, yes, yes. And the thing is, like, even not just we, I like I like to continue going deeper with that, that you just asked. Because later in life, I didn’t think about that there. But later in life, I understood I know. I understand this, this this concept of home now. Home is not a place is a state of being. Because when the beams of light started to appear here, in the physical realm, I started to heal. Right. I started to talk to my parents, I started to feel well, I started I want to interact with others, I started to eat my physical. I was very ill. And after drowning worse, so I was like I you started to feel well, so. So I now later in life, I said, I understand I didn’t have to go anywhere. Now that the beans of library here and I felt that sense of well, being I fell in love, I fell care, I felt that I was not alone. And then this is the other thing. Because I felt that I did not have attachment with my name. Reek with my persona. I was throwing big tantrums. And then they will call me to my name and I will get aggravated. And there was an evening that they were calling me for dinner and the lady was like Ingrid Ingria. Like that, and then just ignore it. And then she came and I said, Ingrid, don’t you here we’re calling you for dinner. And I turned to her and I said Do not call me like that. That is not my name. And she looked at me and she’s like, so what is your name to just aggravate it? And I said I do not need one.
RICK: They must have thought you were a strange little kid.
INGRID: Everybody that is cool. Why did we that child? Yeah. And then that night rake is when I they sent me to bed. I was so aggravated. So sad. And it was the first time I heard I hear voice for the first time.
RICK: Now the voice was speaking in Spanish or was it more pre verbal, so it didn’t it was conveying ideas, without any specific language being expressed.
INGRID: You know, that’s, that’s incredible, because I never even thought about it until people asked me and then later when I pay attention. It was like, Yeah, I don’t think there was a sense of really like a language. Or I cannot tell you if it’s a man or a woman, I cannot miss none of that. So, but I have had experiences where I hear clearly a voice that is more female or male. Yeah. But with the beams of light, depending who is talking, it will be different. And I didn’t have the again the sense of language and but there’s been other occasions in my life. Like when I wrote my book, everything came in English. So I wrote out the language was English, it was amazing. Like when I get many of the teachings they come in English so so you know the pen is like a download. But I bet if you’re kind of paying attention deeper to who’s there’s not really a language, I guess we translated that way.
RICK: I would imagine that in the realm where these Beings of Light dwell, it wouldn’t it would be too gross to have a physical spoken language you know, of which there are many 1000s on the earth they would just communicate telepathically but it wouldn’t be in human language.
INGRID: Yes, that’s why I think at the end, we could when we are that level of being we can communicate with anybody. It doesn’t matter. The physical language that we manage, we can hear written communicate and once you start having that telepathic communication like when I talk to people, even from other countries, even people that write to me where I already have this sense I know their their thing, even if they can speak a different language. Yeah, because he goes deeper than that. But another thing separate also from the language is the names. That’s the first time the beings of light said to me, they talk to me like in a whisper Like, they were like, Let’s This is our secret, they said to me, is going to take time for them to understand. And imagine and I can hear and they said that in the realm of the line names are not needed. You don’t imagine the sense of relief that that gave me. Because he’s the sense I am not crazy. I don’t need a name. I know now why I don’t need a name. Because they said they’re not needed. Now, you already know that. So people ask me to like, what are the names of these guys is being supplied essentials, and I say, I never care for a name. Yeah, because I already know that names are not needed. But of course, later I understood here in our physical realm, in our human experience, of course, we like a container, a basket, we need a name, profession, we have our uniqueness, our purpose, so that’s beautiful. But beyond this realm is not needed. Yeah. I have
RICK: a friend who had a profound spiritual awakening and, and sees Beings of Light. And I didn’t know that at first. But we were at a conference in California. And he told me that he sees being so polite, he actually, you know, sees them clustering around people out on the patio and things like that doing something. He didn’t know what the attending to people somehow. And later on, we’re going home, and we were in the San Fran elevator in the San Francisco airport. And I was really curious about and I said, Hey, are there any in this elevator? And he just kind of smiled. And then we got out of the elevator? And he said, he said, they said to me, don’t point us out to people. If they are meant to see us, they will see us.
INGRID: Yeah, that’s my experience, too. They said Do not talk about us.
RICK: Yeah, I mean, you can talk to like, like we’re doing right now. But if, if you’re if you’re sitting in a restaurant, you wouldn’t and the waiter came over you you would say hey, you know, there’s a being a light around the restaurant.
INGRID: No, I don’t do that. And also people you you know, read one of the things that being said to me through Tom Wood, all the you know that my book is full of teachings, but they said to me, in read your path is the path of gentleness. You’re not here to convince anybody about anything. So do not interfere, do not go saying things. Now I do it because we do it for the general. And if someone wants to listen, somebody is in tune with us, they will come and listen. And if they don’t, and if they don’t agree, it’s okay to all of us are in our own path. But now the time also arrived in my life, when I met a person in my job actually was working at a dull moment for the US Navy, I met a friend. And it’s when the beings of light told me you can tell her everything. Oh, cool. But by then I was already 40. Yeah, in 41 years old. So all those years have passed. They said Do not they said the time will come read the new. And this is another thing that I talk about. And it’s in my book, I started to have visions, since I was four years old. And I already knew, at the beginning, I didn’t know that those were visions later in my life on when things will I will see them on they will manifest it with like wall. And sometimes it was little things and later, which is other big things. But it was like I remember my parents brought me to see the ocean for the first time and I was completely mesmerized. And I said to my mom, she got to actually have to kind of shame me because I would just get like, and she and I say Mom, someday I’m going to nobody was there. No. And it was no like, oh, someday I’m going to know what is there under that blanket. And when I was five years old, I approached my dad and I said that when I grow up, I’m going to be a marine scientist. And he’s like, okay, and I was born in the ocean in the mountains, sorry, away from the ocean. So but I already knew these things, right? When I was 12. I had a vision. Imagine I was born in Colombia, when I thought I would ever work for NASA or nothing like that middle class girl didn’t even think my future nothing What am I going to do? And then I had this vision where I was shown the exact building the the road, the place where I was going to work when you were 12 when I was 12. And when I was in these place 20 something years later, I you almost floor I told my husband, I’m going to work there, and I’m going to work there and he’s like he was lost.
RICK: How do you think that works?
INGRID: You know it Reagan, there’s a lot of things about our time and how time works. But I think that what we do is that we said like May your milestones I just say is like we have that knowing within ourselves we even before we come in I know that we have what we call a pre plan. Yeah. But so always people are nice. So we are predestined. And I said, No, no, it actually is even like it works here. Now I could just decide I’m going to go to college. So I set a milestone. But what is going to happen before I have my degree, I don’t know which electives I’m going to take, how many? How long? I’m going to take doing these two years, three years. So I said is the same thing? Yeah, like we said, Me your goals, and how we get there. My very, yeah. And sometimes I also have experience these I call it I call it like, I say that the time is, like, I have, like a ruler made of cheese is the horizontal and the vertical time. I think that when you have big awakenings, you cut the time, I think there’s things you don’t need to experience anymore. So there’s certain things that we’re going to bring you to certain challenges to certain things to, to grow to evolve, and you have these while somehow these big awakening in your life now there’s things you don’t need. So it’s like you jump, and you just experience something else. I know that because all the experiences I have had. So where I just thought why that didn’t happen, or why that change was so big and the being sold. I said to me, because you didn’t need it anymore.
RICK: Yeah, that’s a good point. There’s a verse in the Yoga Sutras where it says avert the danger, which has not yet come. And the idea is that you might have some loads of karma coming down the pike, you know, but you can actually work it off before it gets here. And so, you know, maybe you were destined to break your leg or something. But instead, you stub your toe, and you just, you don’t have to go through the big bad thing that was going to happen.
INGRID: Yes, yes. Look, there was a time where I went to ask for this job. And at the time, I was like the expert in mangroves, mangroves, ecosystems in Colombia have done this big research. So and I didn’t get hired for the job. So imagine in the mind was like, Oh, my, I wasn’t good enough. We all the stuff that we create in the head, you know, like, oh, hold the drama. And then, okay, I didn’t get the job. Years later, about five years late After thinking for all those years how I could I did not, I was the one for that job. And then, five years later, four years later, I learned that the person that actually got the job was killed by the robots interesting in one of the field trips, and I asked they being so ly later, like, they said, You did not need that challenge. You might not have died, but you might have been really bad injured or whatever, but you did not need that challenge. So it was not for you.
RICK: This brings up an interesting question. Are the beings of light, like passive observers who just have a broader perspective on the whole course of of your life? Or are they actually more like puppeteers who are sort of influencing events like preventing you from getting that job, for instance, because of the potential danger because they happen to know that you no longer needed it? So they’re actually, you know, messing with the mind of the of the employer and saying, you know, don’t give her that job?
INGRID: No, really, I think that is a little bit of both. Because there are certain things in which I would have say, why these happen these way these or I would just say, these didn’t come from me, I feel I am a vehicle to be honest, there are certain things that I just think that I’m just the vehicle for things to happen. So I just opened myself to that. And the other thing is that there’s there’s I think they were like a guide, they never have told me actually in my life, why what to do. Yeah, or were or which decisions to make, but there’s something which they aren’t just like guidance, they suggest, but you and I’ve been really rebellious in my life. So there was moments in which I would just say to them, I’m not doing that. How could you say that to the beings and even when they asked me I when I was 19 years old, they asked me if I wanted to actually be a teacher. If I wanted to keep going in this puddle of spirit and being a spiritual teacher and I said no, I’m not going to teach anything. I don’t want to teach anything to anyone I want to be normal. I want to be like everyone else and that was that time when I I pretty much as the beans of like, can you just please give me kind of alone. And people ask me How could you do that? And I said because it’s like if you have parents and at some point you go college and you want to do your own thing but this was beautiful, right? Because I said your parents are always one call away is not that a but by and I never saw them again. But it was the sense that I could have My experience, I could go on my path. So I think there’s a little bit of wild like, I would just say like with our parents, they cannot force you to do anything, but that they can guide you and tell you all in we don’t do that. Look, I have had that experience watching you. But it’s my decision at the end. So I don’t think we’re puppet. I just think that they’re guiding us and rdn there’s, I believe, and I think there’s this freewill.
RICK: Yeah, I agree. And obviously, if they were controlling every bit of our life, even if we had free will, but but they were exerting so much control, we’d get lazy. And, you know, we wouldn’t develop our autonomy. You know, our self sufficiency and self sufficiency, obviously, is a critical stage of development.
INGRID: Yeah, and challenges wouldn’t be necessary because for what, yeah, so, so, yeah, so we actually all these experiences, I mean, at the end, life is here to challenge us so we can go back to to remember or or we can go back to the place of realizing I am that consciousness, I am that light, I am What if everything is being done, like you say, for us, then we will never
RICK: tell, like not developing muscles because you never get to lift the heavyweight or anything.
INGRID: But there’s also things that they kind of know, like, when I asked them, there was a moment where I just when I told him I want to continue doing my thing, but they kept saying to me, I don’t know, this is another story, but one day I was sitting in a bus rake and and I would look in through the window and I felt like I was an observer. This is how I fell also my library that I was an observer and I asked what he said that I am observing and they say life through your own personal experience. So and I felt that with the beams of light I was providing feedback is the feedback is amazing. So I was just then in these bars and then I always say be careful what you ask because at this moment there was a lot of problems our home my parents weren’t close to divorce my sisters you know, we were all teenagers and it was a chaos chaos. And I’m in in these balls and I just said I wish none of this was real. Because in my heart I was all these years wanting to be to die actually rake I wanted to die. And then I said I wish none of these were real. And the bosses started to dissolve. And with my eyes open there I am sitting and I started to have the clarity they have the the organic and inorganic constituents that made these bass possible. And I’m starting to see these like, like everything is just dissolving in trillions of particles. And unlike boy, including me, and at that moment, the same thing I experienced during my near that I experiencing that boss it was the sense of nothingness. Like pure consciousness pure presence. I’m like it was really fast though. And now everything was back. And I had I have the knowing and and later on through time the being so light said to me nothing is what it appears to be. And then at that moment, Rick, I came with two questions. How is it possible to forget who we truly are. And when we did we stop being one with the whole when this whole separation happened? But I’ve done moment the beat so I knew that I wasn’t ready. They knew so that’s another part is the power of like the parents, I guess. The parenting of the beans are live without they look at me and they said oh they told me in 20 years you will understand I got mad at the moment you say I said 20 years. That’s like a forever and a day and and they said that’s what they said they would never argue that’s one thing. Rick there’s no argument. They just go then I didn’t even realize that nothing my life just kept going. I had 20 years of a lot of challenges after I but this is the other thing I put the example that say that you are in a room. And for the first 19 years I had the light on I have the guidance or the being so light right there. I had the light in the room on at the moment I decided to just say to them, let me do my own thing is like I turn off the light in the room is an hour you go walk your path. Then for 20 years I had all these challenges. Of course if you’re in a room with the lights on you see where the furniture is you don’t trip, but if you do not run with the lights off, or now you’re tripping with all the things in that room so 20 years of challenges and 20 years later, without me thinking it was 20 years, of course, I forgot the number I forgot about it. And then is when I had what I call the big awakening.
RICK: Yeah. Which we’ll talk about in detail in a bit. Yeah. Crazy. You know, that reminds me of a great story. It was since some, somewhere in the Vedic literature, there’s this master and the disciple. And the disciples said to the master, teach me about Maya, I want to understand Maya, you know what Maya means, right? Yeah. Yeah. And so the master said, Sure, I’ll teach you about my but I’m thirsty. Would you go get me a glass of water first. So the disciple went off. And he went to a well in a nearby village. And, you know, he was getting some water up from the well. And then he saw this beautiful woman there. And he thought, wow, she’s really nice. So they started talking. And one thing led to the next and they ended up getting married and having children, he started a farm and, and all this stuff and a whole life in that village. And then one day, a big flood came, there’s a great big storm, and this flood came, and one by one, his children got washed away, and his wife got washed away, and everything was getting, he was about to die. And he and he remembered the master and he said, Master, saved me. And book, the flood was gone, and nothing was happening. And the master was standing there and, and you know, who’s like, in the master, so where’s my water? So that was like a big lesson than how blinding Maya convey the whole illusion. But maybe we learned something that way that we couldn’t learn by just some intellectual explanation, or anything we have. That leads to a question I was going to ask you Is that why does everybody have to go through all this? You know, life can be so difficult, even more difficult than your life. And you know, you haven’t told us everything that happened. But there were some pretty difficult parts. With so many people who were having a really rough time. What is the evolutionary value of that? You know, if God is a loving God, and if enlightenment is the purpose of everything, ultimately, why do people have to go through such a hard time?
INGRID: I think because, again, we ponder the question of love, but it’s because we’re trying to log that love and that joy and happiness outside ourselves. Life is not here, rake to give us the happiness life is not here to give us the joy. Life is here to challenge us. So we can find that joy that happiness that love within ourselves. And when we are keep looking outside life is going to shake us harder saying go look inside. No but I want to look outside then you will shake your heart no you look within and there’s moments in which people have to go through very bad signals to even to press on to finally top like shake you so hard that you stop and he’s just when you if you do that then go to that place where you pretty much close your eye close. The idea of thinking the world is giving half to give me these and you start finding it within there’s nothing I have to look outside because I am it but if you don’t get shaken out how are you don’t see it. You will always pursue it as something that is outside of you and you will think you are in luck. Because incredibly will always have been that I always like the question that says if if the core of who you are is joy, love happiness, peace silence grayness. The real question is What am I doing to disturb that? So if we keep looking outside life is going to come with these challenges to show us a stop looking you know, lacking these you are this. That’s why when people and you know the teachings when they said, don’t look for enlightenment, enlightenment. If you’re already enlightened, don’t look for what you already are. The more you seek the less you find the more confused you are. Because you’re looking you in a labyrinth you already that you ready that presence you ready that lie you’re ready that silence so the question is that how I remove the blocks I love this analogy that came to me lately rake is like you have about like the lamp back there. And the wall has his own he has his beautiful bow. That’s what we are this light. But we put a shade on it. The conditioning they tell us whatever it is they believes what we put a shade on it you do not need you know that are you these are your that and then after that I like to always have a cloth, drop it on me and you put another cloth and another cloth and another cloth until that light that you are cannot charge it is shining but cannot be seen cannot express itself is under all these Ledger’s layers of clothing or or shades. And then what we have to do and what life is going to challenge us to start removing these blocks, removing these shades I said people look an onion. What do you do to get to the core of the onion, you have to remove the layers. But what happened when you remove the layers what happened when you chop it on you? You cry? You cry a lot. So that’s what happened is it hurts to remove all these layers and realize I am not any of this. Until you get to that lighter who you are. One time I we were talking about vibrational frequency with some people vibrational high low vibrational frequency, blah. And the beams of light that night told me Rick, there is only one true frequency. God God’s frequency, or source frequency of consciousness frequency is the same. The idea with the wall, there’s the wall is always shining. These measure of frequencies how far or how many blocks have you put around yourself to stop being light. The more you are involved, the more connected you are, the higher the frequency, the higher the vibration, the more stress you put, the less you shine your light.
RICK: So how would you answer this question? Why can’t we all just come in as little children and you know, kind of have the kind of knowing that you had after the tank, but without having to drown? You know, just we grow up knowing that stuff naturally. And we don’t cover ourselves with 1000 covers that block our light, we just sort of enjoy growing into our full potential and live a beautiful life. How come life doesn’t? How come we have to get all lost and confused and or and find our way back again? I could give an answer to this question. I want to hear what you would say.
INGRID: I just say even with the experiences I had, like when I said I turned off the light, I realized how easy was to get lost How easy was to forget. So I think anyways, like in the experience I had in the tank and through all my life, the realization I am an eternal being is because a long time ago we turn that switch off is not just in this life, the fact that we die. Look, I have this experience, right, I started to see spirits when I was six years old. So the fact that we come to these live right now doesn’t mean we are awake. It doesn’t mean that babies awaken yet is pure and innocent. But the fact just to show you how I learned I started to see spirits when I was six. And the spirits caused me fear. So I asked the beans I told my mom at that moment, I already knew my mom could see spirits and all that.
RICK: So when you say spirits, you mean spirits, not beings of light. But you started to see spirits,
INGRID: spirits, spirits. And again like this, this question of vibration, I felt something different. I felt lower vibrational yes lower by and they cost me like terror, who’s like, Whoa, what is with this stuff? And then I went to my mom, when I saw the first period, and I told her mom, the beams of light on the spirits are not the same. And then my mom started to okay is playing them well that he said that you see. And I just plan and she’s like, wow, she almost started to cry. And she’s like, I think that you see angels? And I just said to her? No, Mom, I don’t think they’re angels because they don’t have wings. So my mom was like, oh, but they have to be your guardian angels, because of the light and stuff. So because I’ve been talking with them for a while. And I went and I asked them and I said to them what is with these spirits? Because they cost me fear. And then I thought the answer was going to be read like oh, they are different, whatever. And then at that moment, the answer was incredible because they say that thing that you call a spirit. You are not we’re all the same. The only difference is the level of awareness you have are who you truly are. And just with your example with with the well how easy is to forget who we are how is to get tangled. The beans of life show me a kaleidoscope and the lie that comes the source light and they show me that you know how it forms all these beautiful images of light and color and they said people think that that’s the real thing. When that is the Lucia. So we get trapped in the illusion and it’s so easy to get trapped there. So I think we leave home because like you, like, happen with this analogy that you are this story about this teaching you you leave and you get trapped in the illusion is and is so sweet and it looks so good. And you feel so great, then now as you treat to go back and realize this is not the trick. Yeah.
RICK: And I think by the time you get back to it, you appreciate it more having gone through the whole rigmarole you appreciate it more,
INGRID: you appreciate it more exactly. And now this is the other thing at the moment, I also asked the beings of light, my mom say that you are angels? Is that what you are. And that was incredible, because they said you can call us whatever you want. And the other thing was is like pretty much it was they expressed to me, we are to you, whatever you want us to be. So see, even that is a part of the illusion when when we are because all all of these is an expression of consciousness is that the kaleidoscope showing us look at all these. But all these are the same time again, like we were talking is bringing us back to that place of Remember who you truly are. And appreciate that like your greatly deeply.
RICK: This conversation reminds me of a poem by TS Eliot, he said, We shall not cease from exploration and the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time.
INGRID: Hold. I love that. Oh, yes. Beautiful. Yes, yes. So I even have a story, a story in my book, which is really really cute. I was a five years old. And he was an and I think I never told this story other than in the book. And she was so mean. And she came to me and she told me are this could be a good answer for this. And she told me that she said that my mother didn’t love me. Because she was our sheet, she always wanted conflict with my mom, she was very envious of my mom, there was a lot of problems between them. And she this and being so mean five years old, and she said, your mom don’t love you. Because you don’t look like your sisters. Look at you with these dark eyes. And she always kept my hair short because I’m curly. So she didn’t know what to do with this curly hair. And so I was just I felt why my mom don’t love me. And she said, um, by the way, you’re not your dad’s daughter. Because my dad was blond with blue eyes, and my sister looked more like him, my sisters, and I did. So imagine how this person is so bad. The thoughts in a child. And then I was so suffering and Unbeliev what she said, and my parents I started to really be like, bad, like, I was throwing tantrums. I was like, and they’ve been so like, tried to talk to me, and I didn’t want to listen. So yeah, I will revalue. So you have to be right, because it’s true. My sisters are beautiful. And I’m not. So an aunt came to visit, and I went to live in her house for a while because my parents thought maybe this is the solution. Maybe she should go somewhere for a while, and she’ll come down. And she will learn to appreciate. And then they send me away they now I thought my my aunt is right, they’re getting rid of me. Then I had all this experience of being away from home and feeling what was to be away from home. And finally, I got really depressed there, I wanted to come back home. So look at all the challenges I had to experience of going to this place leaving home to come back and and realize I want to be home, I really appreciate home. And this was the first time in those five years of my life that I finally felt that I had some placing in my human mind, in my in my home as human.
RICK: Yeah. And to sort of rehash the same cycle on a larger scale. If you think of everything you’ve been through in your life from drowning in the tank, and then everything you went through for several decades. And then finally having this awakening, which we haven’t talked about yet, but we will, you know, think how well you’re able to function now and explain things and do things from the from on the foundation of that awakening, then you were when you were three years old, and he had just had this experience in the tank and you didn’t know what was going on. So you really had to go through all this stuff in order to be a much more capable representative of you know, that deeper reality.
INGRID: Yes, exactly right. Because that was like that all these things were happening for me in a natural way, like I was, I don’t know, I think by 17 I started to be able to communicate with plants. I could hear the plants I was having all these axes I could, what would the plants say? Oh, no sounds using out but there was
RICK: some knowledge some some new transmission. Yes at
INGRID: the beginning was I started to be able to hear the grass. And I was like, Oh, it here like almost like a symphony like this first thing credible, as something I have never heard. And I asked the beans are like what is going on and they said is welcoming you interesting. People don’t know that the nature welcomes them. And I like a symphony of sound, we don’t even know, I once
RICK: met this Indian sage, he was really a sage. But his he was a specialist in plants and herbs and things like that. And he said that the plants would talk to him and tell him what they were, what their purpose was in terms of some medicinal value, he could just walk wander down the path and the plants would actually communicate what they were for that level of communication.
INGRID: I had a similar experience like that I was studying the the back remedies, or for the he did from flowers. And I was in one of these retreats and they put all these plants in front of us. And that was the first time that I they they said right on on this paper, what do you feel the plants are telling you as part of the whole retreat? And is when i i wrote all the answers, right? So I got freaked out, I didn’t even realize I was having communication at the level with the plants. But again, recap the time. I didn’t understand my uniqueness. I didn’t understand why I was different. I didn’t understand why these things were happening to me. And then for me, I didn’t really want to share it with most people I didn’t it was apart from my grandmother. Yeah, I was going to Transcendental Meditation to all these things, or doing all these spiritual things. But I was always very quiet. And there’s a moment where the heaviness of wanting to be like everyone else was really hard. Because I had now three sisters, they were beautiful, and the boys and the parties and life and then I started college and I was like I am tired of being different. So I couldn’t really appreciate all these gifts, or like the way I do now. I could not really understand what was happening. So yeah, I had to go through all those, I think is maturity and at all levels, psychologically, emotionally, mentally to to be able to be where I am today. Yeah.
RICK: A question actually came in from a fellow named William in tech in Houston. And he has been following you. He said since cu at the ions conference, International Association of near death studies conference. And his question is, do you think that nd e teachers like Anita Moorjani yourself and others have profound messages to teach the world about spirituality and how to evolve? It’s a two part question. That’s the first part.
INGRID: I I think that not just knew their experiences as I think that anybody that has gone through through profound, profound, I would just say, a spiritual experiences, profound experiences that bring us to realize who we truly are.
RICK: Yeah. You don’t need to drown to do that.
INGRID: Yeah, is better you Dawn, right. So so yeah, just an ease No, like anybody that also has to be noise start doing the work. Because people ask me, like, how can I get there? How can I hear being sort of lion empathy, they don’t want to do the work. And they said, What is the work? Are they beginning his work? But like I said, meditation for me is not doing from I started to meditate when I was eight years old, Rick. And for me meditation, I finally was like, wow, to me is a state of being but it started as a doing. So for me is like,
RICK: it was pleasant from the beginning. Right? It wasn’t. It wasn’t difficult.
INGRID: No, it was extremely pleasant. It was incredible. When I was 12, my grandmother brought me to the first Buddhist temple. And this was like and hurt in Colombia. But that was the thing they’ve been so like I said, people will come to your past to guide you and to help you and that just happened. So that like you said, there’s things that are being worked out anyways, like we at all levels of being we work together. They’ve been so light, like here on Earth. There’s also beans working with us on all levels. So my grandma took me to this temple, and I did this there was the first breathing meditation technique break and I’m just And I felt this feels so good i and at that moment, I started to remember past life since I was also very young. And it was the sense I already have experienced things like this. And then when we were to leave, I told the monk, I said, we cannot come back my grandma’s, a very busy woman. And he said, Oh, don’t worry, don’t worry, child, he said, You will never have to come back because you already have a temple. And I said, What do you mean? And he said, You are the temple. So where whenever wherever you can practice this breathing meditation, and for me, that was key, right from that day is like, Ha, I am a temple. So I kept just money I’m doing, but when nowadays I tell people the work is to come the mind, that is who I will look, Rick when I had my new that experience, and I mentioned to you what I knew is that power of the that essence that I am, at ease, choose, of course, absolute presence, but he was silence. He was that a space of calmness, peace, and I don’t say silence of noise was calmness, sinus of silence of thoughts, silence of of all the stuff that we accumulate inside ourselves, it was like a spaciousness. So when I said people to, because they asked me, How can I connect with being sunlight, so you have to quiet your mind and the work of quieting your mind and I said, go walking, meditation, do whatever, all these different practices for us to start learning quieting your mind. And the more you quiet your mind, the more space you create, the more you remove those blocks, and you take those sheets off, and now you’re vibrating. are you connecting with everything?
RICK: The second chapter, second verse of the Yoga Sutras says Yoga is the cessation of the fluctuations of the mind. And then the next verse says, And then this, then you rest in the self, you know, so ancient teaching, and, and people shouldn’t feel any longer people who are listening to this, perhaps some people meditate, and some never have, and maybe some have tried it. And it’s been difficult, and they think, but, you know, if you go about it, right, as I know, you know, it’s not only enjoyable, in and of itself, so it’s no big chore, or it doesn’t take a great deal of self discipline to do it. And, but then the after effects are enjoyable. So it’s kind of a win win situation. And, and one of the things I’ll just throw in there is that the, I don’t think I think you and I both agree, the goal of meditation or spiritual practice is not to see beings of light, that that might be a side effect. It might happen to some people and not to others. But that’s not the essential purpose of it.
INGRID: Completely, completely agree with you. So that’s when I say people, if you have a goal, you’re going to be disappointed. People do it, because it is you touching the essence of who you are, because it feels great. Because it’s just, you’re becoming in touch with your light, with the spaciousness of who you are, you know, these analogy that is so beautiful, they’re being so like, they just come with these things. The other day, they show me a room, and it was just a room. And they said, What is the thing that never ever changes in this room? I already have hear about these teachings that are similar. I said, of course they space, the space, and then they started to show me furniture. And then they said See that’s the key. What are you identifying with the furniture or the space? Always be vigilant Are you being the furniture or are you being the space so that’s how we say something that rely when I know that I’m I’m being carried away by my my emotions, my thoughts I stop I am not that I am not the furniture in the room, I am the space. So, if you go calm, because this space is just you go to that place of resting in calmness, many times Rick I have days where I go in and experience again that a state of non self I wake up in the morning and and people say oh you cannot say that time can always exist no matter what. And I said while when I am in the state of absolute presence, calmness, when there’s not Story. To me, there’s no time, because time is a measure of change. And if I in my awareness, there’s no story, there’s no change. And these are moments in which you’re just in this state of absolute presence, ah, is incredible.
RICK: The time is a relative thing. I mean, even physics, not even physics, physics, totally understands that I was just listening to a talk by a physicist named Roger Penrose, and he was saying that for a photon, there is no time. And what he means by that is that the photon, let’s say, coming from the Andromeda galaxy to 2 million light years away from our, from our perspective, it takes 2 million years for it to get here. From its perspective, it’s traveling at the speed of light. And so time and space have completely collapsed and it makes the trip instantaneous. So So time is relative,
INGRID: is very relative is the beam of light at what is the purpose of time. It was awesome to say, the purpose of time and experience is to help you remember who you truly are. So once you remember is not needed anymore.
RICK: I’m William from Houston had a second part to his question. He said, Okay, so he said, you know, do you guys have for you and Anita and people that have found messages to teach the world about spirituality and how to evolve? If so, what does that look like in the realm of education, business, and how to have carrying the message forward? So what he’s saying is, you know, okay, you and Anita have written books, and you give talks, and, you know, and then you other NDA, people have done those things. And, but wouldn’t it be nice if, you know, actual education that millions of children get or businesses that millions of people working? And things like that could could enjoy this kind of insight? And, and how would that come about? How would you introduce it to in those fields,
INGRID: you know, rake is just starting to actually happen. I just recently, I was part of a study, we, I think 20 People 20 Something we wrote this incredible they were doing an A study of of near death experiences. And there was like 22 articles or something we were offered John Hopkins University, and it was for this incredible magazine called nib, and this study, just gather all these experiences. And the idea is that he’s starting to show to the medical community and to the cleric that these experiences happen and that the patients that come back with a memory or with something like this cannot be this regard because actually that will harm more the patient than helping the patient. So we’re trying to eat is actually happening is starting to introduce these concepts and Anistar helping people I do sessions with people online and already this is beautiful. Read I have had a few people that have children, because the article I wrote on a lot of the talks I I give Of course I am a child. I knew that experience that I had, I was so little and life so hard. So now people are coming to me and saying I understand what is happening to my child. I somebody even looking at my experience realized that her child she had a near death experience this this child had been suffering so much and the mom could not understand but your bag God brought you back you will be in this grave or wherever. And she saw my talk and she realized oh my god, I get it. My daughter is grieving my daughter is grieving because she had to combat for the first time these mom understood and we had this incredible dialogue I was able to talk to the girl reach up to that point girl she was in this state of like complete distraught quiet wouldn’t talk and we got together oh my god now the girl is another person that’s great. Yes, and it happened with another girl that could see spirits and she was putting an institute for mental illnesses and maybe and the moment that girl and I connected I said I wish I would have made you and These just happen so we are we actually doing the work little by little we’re introducing these and and there’s more openness and and because I guess he’s happening or levels of not just think it’s so important to mention that because he’s also happened to doctors, neuroscientists, scientists, teachers psychologies, everybody’s open into it is like Oh, so this is not just something to happen to, I don’t know is sad that it has to happen. You way, but, you know, credibility happen suddenly when experienced by a
RICK: doctor, yeah, sure they have the credentials, or access
INGRID: in now these people can come and say, Well, yes, this is real.
RICK: Yeah, that’s good. I mean, science is the predominant influence of our age. And so if spirituality is really going to go mainstream seems to me science is going to have to understand it and explain it in its own language and kind of give it the stamp of approval and, and then it can be accepted.
INGRID: Yes, yes, exactly. So I think I does it. The other thing people ask me always about that difference between science and spirituality, because I am a scientist. And I said, and I went through all these years, are they are they saying Reiki I just came to, to the realization, the separation is in the mind. Because if the essence of who you are again, going back to that is that of love, compassion, kindness, great, because it all depends what you think that spirituality is. If he says 50 qualities, Be your authentic self is the the core of those principles, then you’re already spiritual in whatever you do. You’re carpenter doctor, and I don’t know driver. If you’re ready, that embodiment of who you truly are, then you’re already spiritual. That’s what all this is about. Go back to the core of who you are. Go back to that essence of who you are, and be your break when I had my big awakening that we haven’t talked about yet. To talk about that soon. And I was working in steel with NASA and with the Navy. It’s when I was like, Oh, how can I tell everybody? How can I tell everybody how this feels because he was this state of clarity of connection of like, I know who I am, I became aware that I am awareness. So how do I and I said as the beans are like, How can I do? What can I do? Or what can I say? And look at the answer, this tells you a lot, right? Because the answer was, do or say nothing. And they say the light of your awareness is all they need. So they said at that moment, be that light, and thus the teaching of all the things ever walk your talk, teach by example. Exactly be that and they and the sane and the doing will come from being not from the head. So that was the big difference right there. Right? So I it was that so I actually started, I said, people is incredible, because spirituality is science. Why science because you have to become an observer of yourself. And you become an observer of yourself and you catch yourself is awareness. You’re inviting awareness into your life and is experiential, because it’s not about believing things are you hear these now go try it. Go try to be kind. If you don’t know your kind, go try and see what happened. Try to be loving try to respect try to this or calm your mind and see what happened is experiential. So I go do it and I was in the corridors and I would just be in a state of presence and emanating that light no gray given the most grumpy guy in the corridor. Buddha stopped by on your smile. And people would say to me, you know everybody in the agency and I say no, I don’t it non person but when we are connected at the level when you are emanating that light people will notice you I explained it your experiment your life is a laboratory. Just use do the experiment you see works.
RICK: Yeah, that’s great. I love what you say there. It’s too bad that spirituality or religion has spent 1000s of years making a big fuss about belief and oh, you’re a believer. You’re not a believer, you know, okay, burned at the stake because you’re not a believer, whatever. Whereas really, the whole thing is about experience and it doesn’t matter tremendously much whether you believe it or not. If you if you experience it then it’s absurd to use the word belief you know, I wouldn’t I wouldn’t say I believe I’m looking at my hand. It’s not the right word because it’s an experience.
INGRID: Exactly. Look, this is key. The beans are lie said to me since I was very young. Read they said to me, even to them, they say do not believe in anything we’re telling you. Do not believe or not, do not believe in anything. But keep an open mind. That’s the key. An open mind is what is going to Jaws discover the potential of everything so that even the beings of lie were saying that to me, do not believe in anything, but keep an open mind. So and that’s what I did since I was I was very little, and people will tell me go back. And I will say, I don’t. So nowadays, when people ask me, Do you believe in this, or whatever? I written my book, my experiences, whatever I say, I don’t believe in anything. I know. I know. And what I don’t know, then I go. And I go deeper. And I try to and I ask a question. So and I tried to experience it. And I do it for myself.
RICK: I remember one time, Oprah Winfrey was interviewing Eckrich, totally. And she was doing this little thing where she would start a sentence and let him finish it. And so she started a sentence that he said, she said, I believe, and he said, nothing in particular.
INGRID: So he’s like, yeah, don’t say I don’t believe in anything. Yeah, that’s what I know. I know.
RICK: Yeah. And I would say that that extends to things like God and angels, and all kinds of stuff that people in the past would say, are matters of belief. But for you, it’s come more into the realm of experience.
INGRID: Exactly. So for me, I’m knowing I am. I don’t have to believe in anything. And that’s what made me very rebellious since I was little, right. Because even at a school, I was in the Catholic school, and I will go to the prison, I said, and I said, Why are you fear? What are you talking about fearing God? That you’re actually walking away from God? Oh, my God, these guy would so much. You’re just a child. What do you know? Those are thoughts of the devil. And I just look at a guy. Yeah. Because I, I said what I had experienced that you didn’t have that concept of God. So when people ask me, Did you see Jesus? Do you see God? I don’t know, I was two years old. I didn’t have a concept of God. But I knew that. That there was just goodness, Raik I knew goodness, I knew greatness. I knew peace. I knew. I even didn’t know the word love. That’s why I don’t mention it during my new that experience. But he was now that I know they were he was love, pure greatness.
RICK: We’ve kind of talked about this, but he was saying earlier how the major events of one’s life are chosen or predestined, or some such thing. I mean, he must feel I kind of get the sense and reading your book, that it was not an accident that you fell into the tank, it was kind of like an initiation, almost where you had to be shifted into this other realm. And that was a way of doing it.
INGRID: You know what, it was not an accident? No. Oh, yeah. That’s for sure. And to answer one of also one of the questions that I forgot his name
RICK: from Houston, Andrew, I think the Andriy
INGRID: asked is like, if we come with a message, actually, there’s a purpose behind our experiences. That’s the other thing with with all of these. Once I started to have more clarity, and I the use of like I said, learn to ask the right questions, and you will receive the right answers. Good point. Yeah. So I started to other questions that are actually simple, is no complicated. And I just started even asking questions, simple questions, right. Like, why am I neither experience happened when I was so young? And the answer was, because you were all enough to remember, but young enough not to be conditioned yet. Perfect. Yeah. So that was key. That was important. And the other thing I said to the beings of like, why am I knew that experience happening? How simple but I never asked. So now I’ve got the answer. They said to bring back the message of the purpose of no other purpose, the power.
INGRID: of connection, right? And then I said how calm is I see those things are even happened to us, and we don’t see it and they say, look, so now they brought me to see the experience and they said, Look, when you saw your body, what was your first answer to that? And look at how the egoic mind at that moment is not the one making the decision. So what was my decision rate said I’m no going back to that body and why The beings of light said that was a steal your egoic mind. Guess what? That that is not what the purpose of the universe wanted for you. So that’s when we’re playing the game of what do we do one what the universe say? What is that we’re coming to do? So this plan was that now you will come in back. So the thing that you’re leaving your body is not true. And they said, reason why you went to look for the help of the lady and the help of your mom. Which I didn’t have awareness even that I was looking for help. But that’s what the universe I was coming back. So I said, Okay, so if I was going to come back, and I was going to look for help, why do I is stopping their mates from Why did I waste time? And they said to me that as the as the point. That’s the point of contrast. And I said, What do you mean, and they said, Look, when you went to look for that, the maid, she did not have connection with you. So she could not hear you. What happened when you went to look for your mom? Look, complete connection. And that’s what we call unconditional love, love doors and have barriers right to the point that there was not any spiritual realm. And our physical realm is love. Complete connection. So my mom sends her whatever it was, and she came back. And then they say, look, the person that was so far away from home was the one that got you out of the tank, the person that was only few feet away, didn’t even know you were there. Then they said to me, Look, with this lady. Look what happened when there is connection, your mom save you know what happened when there is no connection and look at these was beautiful. They say when there is no connection, they will let you drown. When there is no connection, that would be war.
RICK: Yeah. So imagine if there were a deep connection between everybody in the world?
INGRID: Exactly. We didn’t have to have all these crazy craziness that is happening.
RICK: That reminds me of the story of when you were almost raped on that beach. And you suddenly kind of grabbed the guy by his chin, I think and looked into his eyes and you made a connection. And the the connection shocked him. And so he he left.
INGRID: Yes, that his story’s incredible, incredible. Because at that moment rate is when I realized there is no enemy. There is the idea of an enemy, they Lucian of an enemy, he thinks he’s an enemy. I think it’s an enemy because there’s conditioning, all the layers of conditioning. But at that moment at the beach, when all that fell off that men and I felt a sense we are one.
RICK: There’s a lady named Sarah, who I interviewed, maybe six months ago from Australia, and she was literally being beaten to death by this guy. And she needed she eventually she needed reconstructive surgery and all kinds of stuff. But in the midst of that, she suddenly had this shift where she just felt love. And she just saw everything as one and she loved this guy that was beating her to death. And he had this like look of total shock on his face. And he ran away. He just left.
INGRID: Yes, it was the same thing here. So look, your question again, why we go through horror stuff. Because those moments are crude that that will maybe not sometime at the moment, in my experience, you happen at the moment but in so people will happen later they will tie the note. And they will say thanks to that this happened. And thanks to that this and thanks to this illness now. I am more compassionate, I’m more I have more empathy. I have more love, I opened this organization sees like everything. I just know that behind every experience, there’s a purpose. So I said, I said to people don’t stay in experience. Go deeper, go deeper, don’t stay in the near that go deeper, don’t stay co there’s always something behind. And with that guy in the beach, he was not just me how inexperienced that day they’ve been. So like I said to me for all the experiences you’re going to have that are like that. There will be a witness. And these witness he would transform the life of your boyfriend was there and he Yeah, yes. And he was an atheist. Believe in anything. Imagine when he sees that this guy. Three guys in a row. We’re going to read me kill us. I read that later. The police said this is a miracle because we’re looking for a series of murders that have happened in this area. And then he said how this is possible and also because I knew that the guys were going to come back because I knew that that moment of clarity I would just say clarity will go into go away. And I said to him, they’re coming back. So we were able to climb this mountain higher. And he said, How did you know they were coming back? How is it possible that they let us go watch. And I said, You didn’t believe in guardian angels in protective forces, whatever in God, this is the time. And this changed the life of this person.
RICK: Tell the one about when you were walking along with your boyfriend, and some homeless people came up and started robbing you and what your what what your boyfriend experience, then?
INGRID: Oh, that was another incredible one. Again, this changed this person for the rest of his life. Because he was, at the time very angry. I didn’t believe in anything. He thought that my life was unfair, because he had a sort of thing for Mark. Yeah. So he was very angry at that. And then we were walking in the street and already kind of talking to him about his spirituality. I’ve been showing him things that were happening, even like light coming out of my hands, things like that at that level. And he was like, No, that has to be some explanation for that. So that they were walking brick and three homeless people started to come towards us and I just in Colombia, I mean, you see that and you know, you’re going to be robbed, is like, oh, there’s no no other way. So we just kind of held hands thinking maybe they will let us go. Now they came. And they surrounded us. And they were started to take everything from him, his wallet, his everything. And he was in such shock. Like, he couldn’t take his watch. And they were saying, give us give us your watch. And I’m standing in the scene, Rick and I cannot move. And I have one person right here the other day, and I am again, like I am observing. I am an observer of the scene. And then they grab his washing didn’t do it. And they scratch his arm. He was bleeding. And then finally they left with everything. And at that moment, I was able to now talk and I said, something your armies is bleeding. They took your watch. They took everything. And he’s like Ingri I don’t care about the watch. I don’t care about the bleeding. I don’t care about nothing. The only thing I care is that you were not here. They didn’t rob you. They didn’t take anything from you because you were not here.
RICK: In other words, in other words, you became invisible. I became
INGRID: invisible. And that’s what changed his life. Of course. I mean, before an experience like that, he became spiritually started. He had an awakening and he started to use his own experience and his his birthmark and everything to just grow in empathy, compassion to all that, but that was incredible. And I asked the beams of light later, I didn’t know you could make people disappear. And they said to me, Rick, by now you should know that nothing is impossible.
RICK: Probably that you were invisible to the robbers too.
INGRID: Yeah, yeah, I actually was because they were standing here. Take your stuff. Nothing. I had a leather jacket. I have my wall in my morning. Nothing is like I was not in this.
RICK: You know, the visibility is one of the cities that Patanjali talks about as being something that yoga can do.
INGRID: This wasn’t this wasn’t good. I have I have learned about later in life. Yeah, that is I think they talk about this three big things a yogi can do. I think it’s invisibility, invulnerability.
RICK: There’s a whole bunch of them levitation, all kinds of things. Yeah,
INGRID: yeah. And I’m like, what was that? Yeah, that’s incredible. I’m, but the answer of the beans or lie was amazing. By this point, you should know that nothing is impossible.
RICK: Well, we’ve kept everybody in suspense for quite a while. Let’s talk about your big awakening experience that you had the big shift. Yes.
INGRID: And that’s that that’s that’s a little bit long, but we will shorten that is like, after all those sufferings for all those years. Finally, I reached the point Riga using this point on my big despair. But at this point in my life, I had a trip plan to the Middle East. I was going to have this this trip and I went to actually to Singapore made met this lady, we became friends and she said, You have to come with me to meet the Dalai Lama. And finally that all happened I went there I spent like a week with him receiving his teachings and what this is to that moment, after I’ve been kind of so busy doing science and walk away from all of this spirituality, everything, I haven’t done anything like that for so long. And when to meet him, and at that moment was that sense of like, I have walked away from what had given me the greatest joy in my life. The silence the beams of light, the spaciousness, I been so many challenges sufferings angers that I have forgotten. Incredibly if I forgot, I’d like we were talking before. And then it just came back. And I remember being sitting next to the Dalai Lama holding his hand and thinking, in the like I said, in the library of my man 10,000 questions like, What can I ask him and I that moment, I realized, I need to go back to silence. And then I came back home after that tree bunnies when I went into the biggest depression of my life, because I hadn’t had that moment, I realized, how, how could I forget who I am? How could I allow all these sufferings and all these silly stuff to get me and I felt disconnected. And then I have been disconnected forever from all their from my own self. And then I fell in the deepest depression of my life, right. And I wanted to actually kill myself is one touch button. And one day, I’m lying in the bed with my little David next to me, which was the thing that just kept me here. I mean, you know, I will do anything for my little boy. And the these thought, Majan how old thoughts can be so the ego so can in so crazy? And I have this tiny thought? What if I will leave? Why do we live together? What if we die together? Pretty much. And at that very moment, I just opened my eyes and said, I lost that. How could I even think this way? I mean, this is sick, I really am losing my mind. And that was the first time for many years, I had to stop meditating, praying everything because I was angry of many things. And at that moment, Rick, I went into this profound state of prayer. And I didn’t ask for things to change around me. When I went into that prayer, I asked to have clarity. I said, God helped me see because I cannot see. I am blind, I cannot see. And then I went into this, the prayer helped me help me. And the next day I got up and he was I always say that these things are so simple. There’s nothing nothing too complicated. He was thinking this thought you need help. Go to see a psychologist. But it was not a thought like, oh, I my goal, you know, it was not the thoughts of the ego. I’m I do know he was clear. And I just went to my computer look, because I have never wanted help from anybody up to that point. Me psychology. Come on, I am a scientist. I don’t need help. But no, it was clear. I when I type a name, I found this guy, I wrote the name on a paper, and the same day read to other people. One was like, my daughter is visiting these psychologies, and it was the exact same name. And he’s great and another person. So when three at the same day, three things and I have written his name on a paper and I said, Look, I have this same person here. So three people, it was three things that told me about the same person. I said, Oh, this is a synchronicity. This is a message. So I went to meet that guy. And incredibly, he was an amazing psychologist that was very spiritual. So that was a person open to listen. So I started we really simple things. And then I would drop a nugget of something kind of like this. He’s going to think that I lost that thing. No, the guy was always the guy. Yeah, he got it. And
INGRID: so there was a moment regard. He asked me that he wanted me to write a list of sufferings. And then I wrote this list and but I thought first I am a scientist. I don’t write software in spite of how well I’d see the our organs. Then I wrote this list of all the sovereigns, Ling Ling Ling. And when I showed him the list, he looked at the list and he said, in his own experience, of course, there’s people that have suffered more things than me but in his own experience, he said, This is the first time I have seen some somebody see somebody that suffered this much and he’s mentally stable. I’ve never seen someone like this. He said, Wow. But I will shock Ray come like I didn’t never thought I was the one that suffered them all. So why he’s saying these another moment I said to him, why me? Why this is happening to me. And the answer was amazing again, so simple. He said, why not? Watch the moment he said why not. And he was incredible because this is the power of listening. When I realized that he had been listening that connection when he started here and never have a notepad, and at that moment, he said, Look things that you did this looping here, thanks to the data, this happens thanks to these these things. And I’m like, Wow, no, my neurons all my everything is started to connect. And I started to find purpose behind all my experiences, right like thin, thin, thin. And at that moment, I just say to people, I stopped being a victim, I stopped being at the level of the fat. And I became the cause I started to say, I am all these is not happening to me is happening for me. And then even the most crazy stuff, the thing I hate the most everything at the moment makes sense. And for me, I came into the state of absolute gratitude. Reiki was, I don’t have to change anything. I don’t have to delete anything, I don’t have to, because it’s all perfect. This all happened for me to be where I am now, today in this chair. And the other clarity came, and he was the knowing that none of that was here anymore. Everything was in my head. So it was the awareness of I am not the thought. I am not this experiences, I am not this noise. And I can decide right now what to do with all of this. So he was going back to that empty space. And then oh, wow, that officer Oh, this is the other thing I experienced rate is when and I read a later how they use the the idea of forgiveness. But at that moment, is when the true forgiveness happen. Which is this knowing that there’s nothing to forgive, because nothing ever happened. Nothing ever happened to me. So imagine that state of freedom, right? That state of like, liberation comes of the mind is like if I’m walking in the clouds, I went into my car and I started to drive. And then I heard that similar experience I had in the boss 19 years before happened in that car that day. I’m driving the car. And it was like the presence of what we call source the Creator God was absolutely everything right. There was nothing that was not it. The windshield, the car, the report, everything was that emanation of the presence. Everything was love. There’s nothing that is not it. I had to stop the car and I’m like, This is who I am.
INGRID: There’s nothing else. And then now it comes now after that, of course, after after that hash tag of Clary. And I knew this is the other thing at the moment. reconnu that 20 years have passed from the time they told me 20 years you will understand. Because the two questions I asked 20 years before were answered. Another moment when I’m like, like not even 20 years had passed. And the questions were How can when do we stop being one with the whole? And how’s it possible to forget? And the answer was one never stop being one. One never left the source. And look at this one just became distracted and seemingly forgot. We really never, we truly never forget we that’s why we want to go back to that. What does is that that sense of like, why you want to why you want happiness, because you want to go back to it. Why you want love because you want to go back to it. So we never really forget. We just get distracted. And that’s what happened.
RICK: Yeah. And I imagine that now, having gone through that whole 20 years. You know, your questions are answered in a living way. Much better than any little communication could have taught you back then you had to go through all this and now it’s really profound. It’s in your bones.
INGRID: Yes, and you know, right because this is the power also with spirituality and when the confusion can happen because he’s not just to become a self realized Veen but how you integrate that into your lives become self actualized? In what do I do with this? And then you have those is all different levels of awakening your awakening or realizing I am awareness. But now what do I do with this? So why don’t we will say, the awakening of the heart, the awakening of the next level? How do I share it? How do I do it? How do how I am that Live for the world? And now how I ground this? How I bring it to fruition? How I share it with others, like he’s asking his question how I put my feet in the ground, and bring these to the rest. Then you have to go to all this process because look, I was here in Oregon, when I was little, I will look at others reckon I said that people stupid, they don’t know anything, because I didn’t understand, then I have to go through all the sufferings, through understand compassion, to understand the kindness to have the empathy to go to that place of connection, the beams of light we’re talking about. And then oh, now I had that very profound level. And all my levels of being I understand.
RICK: Yeah, you know that that answers more thoroughly the question that I asked about an hour ago, which is, you know, why can’t we just be born like enlightened little kids and stay that way? Why do we have to go through all this stuff? But you just explained it? You know, yeah, you have to go through all this stuff. Because then it becomes, you become an embodied, fully embodied representative of higher consciousness, it’s, it’s not just, you know, you can deal with, with all different levels of concern all different levels of reality, you can, you know, you don’t have to do sort of, like you said, when you were a child, try to sleep all the time. So you can just get inward and have that experience, you can do it totally in the waking state totally engaged in raising family and having a business and doing everything that but you can maintain, you know, that that well, being higher consciousness or whatever. In the midst of all that, yes.
INGRID: And actually, like you say, is cool when I said, Why, why do I want to wake up people saying like, because he’s awesome, you become more intelligent, you know what to do. Like with the guy in the beach, I knew how to handle at all levels of being, even if you use your energy level, can shock somebody will your eyes, that person will run away? When I was working in all these projects, even though I didn’t have the connection I have now. I always was connected. Rick and I created incredible projects. I was never at the level of the problem. I was always how do I solve this problem? And this is the other thing, the more awakened, you become the problems or the challenges are not don’t become problems. They become opportunities. Yeah. So it doesn’t mean that I don’t have challenges. But when a challenge come now I’m like, bring it up. Because exactly, I know. And of course, sometimes I have my head under the water, I’m not going to say that I don’t cry on the screen, but is faster and easier. Are you going to have a friend, she’s amazing. They’ve been so ly said to me learn to recognize that reset button, the the triggers, but also have reset buttons create your spiritual environment. So the spiritual environment is the ball with a friend the place that you can go back to alignment. So I have this friend and I just call her and I’m like, whatever it is. And she’s that. And she just later confessed to me that I just weighed that we hung the phone and you call me like an hour later, whatever they later with the answer. So I’m waiting because you’re going to bring new teaching, you’re going to bring new awakening. And that’s what happened you we see our challenges as opportunities, we keep evolving, we keep growing, we can just and and we can help others to to see their problem or their challenges as an opportunity to grow.
RICK: I remember when I started meditating, I was I was living with this family and they had seven kids and a dog and a pet raccoon and orca rock band in the basement, all kinds of stuff. And so I used to go out the back and climb up in a tree and meditate in a tree house that they had built up there and it was a nice quiet place I could get away from everything. So so they they made of the song about me based on hey dude by The Beatles, and it was it was like, Hey, dude, up in your tree, you know, get out of you and into me, you know, but but the point was that by getting into oneself, but but sort of dipping into pure awareness, one’s true nature and one that has the resources to bring to bear on whatever you want to do in the outer world.
INGRID: Yes, and you know, recreate the real change, I’m going to give you this, this really cool teaching. One day, my husband had these back pain. And I’m sitting in my studio there working and he comes off, I’m going to get a massage because my back hurts. And he left and on the beam. So like I said to me, he’s not going to heal. And I’m like, what? And they said, No, because that’s the that’s already a result, he’s not going to heal, because that’s not the cause. That’s the result, right? It’s a deeper cause. Exactly that he has to go to the level of the courts exactly to change within. So they said, so they show me an equation. And they said, Look, one plus one is two, you cannot change the number two, you cannot change, the result is already a result, you have to go within. So the analogy was go go within and create a new equation. When you go within now you were and you are able to see things from a deeper place. Now you can create a new Rosol not now one plus two is three. And he said, and they say look at how much energy and how much people wasting trying to change results. When they have to go to the costs. They have to go within they have to resolve it from within and what happened, will you create a new reality?
RICK: I’ll give you two analogies, you probably have heard this, because you actually learned TM back in the old days. And we used to use this as a TM teacher. But one thing is if you want to shoot an arrow, you can’t just put it on the ball and let go. Because it’ll just fall to the ground, you have to pull it back first. And then that prepares you to you know, prepares the AR to really shoot forwards are another analogy. As you know, if you want to spend something in the marketplace, you need to go to the bank first and get some money and then then you’ll be able to spend. So we can think of many other examples. But going within is preparation. It has its own intrinsic value, but it’s preparation for whatever else you want to do. You know, Krishna said to Arjuna transcend. And then he said established in yoga, perform action. And then he said yoga is skilling action.
INGRID: Yes, yes, that’s right, Rick. That’s why when the beans of light talk about doing this saying that has to come from being is because that’s the place where true creation happen. When we are in tune when we are connected to the deadness of who we are. That’s when we’re acting and does what we’re saying come from the place of awareness, from the place of wisdom from the place of clarity. The views of lie once said to me, in reducing that you are actually thinking, and people are all the time thinking and I said yeah, of course all the time. And they said to me No. Most of the time, people are not truly thinking they’re not using the true gift of thinking. They’re just remembering, We’ll trap most of the time 98% of the time in our own memories. The only way to be connected with the true creative thinking of the universe is by quieting the mind by going with them by reconnecting with that center of beingness. And from there. The doing and the same while are very powerful. And then we also start receiving clear messages even about knowing what to do. Now I am whenever wherever and it could be in the bathroom, it don’t matter and I can hear a message. I hear the voice. The inner voice actually sent to me. A challenge is coming. Imagine that ragdoll gives me the time that gives me the possibility to go back and center myself. Go back to that place of balance quiet in my mind and connect with my inner wisdom. And then from there I can be ready for what is to come. So if I know just to give an example that are a car accident is happen, I can buckle up and be ready for what is to come. That’s one of the great perks of waking up is that you can use that awareness, that wisdom, that connection to be that awakened being in action.
RICK: And I would suggest that, you know, not everybody’s gonna hear Beings of Light, giving them tips that things are coming. But you know, life, you know, like things come things are gonna happen, there’s always gonna be challenges. So, time to prepare.
INGRID: I mean, yes, I mean, these kids, that’s why I mentioned my, my inner voice, because there’s different ways to receive communication, we all try to leave it in the outside. But it’s not like that. We, we have what is called inner wisdom, we have our inner voice we have been, we’re eternal beings are having experiencing so much get imagine the library of knowledge that we have within ourselves. And the connection of who’s now we have been so like the universe, whatever, what would they call Akashic records, everything else is everything is a library of knowledge, when we learn to quiet our mind, or we connect with
RICK: we all got we all knowledge.
INGRID: Exactly. And we know what to do. Yes, amazing.
RICK: Yeah, sometimes that that field of being is referred to in the ancient traditions as like the home of all knowledge. And, and, you know, what that means is that even though you as an individual couldn’t possibly know all the details about everything, you know, there’s just no one individual possibly could, if you’re, if you’re sort of dwelling and and functioning from that level, then you get the benefit that would be had by knowing all the details, even without having to know all the details.
INGRID: Yes, yes. So, you know, it’s a much profound knowing. You know, you’re, you’re now actually become your own guide. You have your own GPS on and you’re guiding yourself. Yeah. So this is incredible. This is amazing.
RICK: Yeah, Lord is my shepherd. I shall not want. 23rd Psalm beautiful description of what we’re talking about.
INGRID: Absolutely beautiful.
RICK: Okay, well, we better wrap it up. Thank you so much for this conversation. During this conversation, we’ve been alluding to little points here and there in your book, but the whole book is very interesting. And you know, I would recommend that people read it if there’s it. Here’s, I’m just showing your website on the screen right now. Ingrid Honkala, PhD, and I’ll have a page on bat gap comm that has a link to your website and a link to your book and everything. You see what I can do here, I’ll just scroll down the page. There you are. There’s a couple of videos that very nice professional videos that were made. I’m showing pictures of your book now. It’s been translated into Spanish also. And then some testimonials from people. And some videos from you very nice website. No, thank you. Yeah. Anyway, thanks, Ingrid. It’s been great getting to know you. And I already knew you pretty well, before we even started talking today. Because I’ve sort of been in your world for the past week, but it’s been a lot of fun.
INGRID: Thanks so much, Ray. Yeah, there’s, there’s a lot of fun and I just if I can share one more thing before we leave, if that’s okay, but I just, I just say to people and this is one of the last teachings I receive is that remind people to go back to that place of gratitude. Gratitude is is that what we are that’s why it’s the highest vibrational frequency that is and they’ve been so like lately said to me in great if you don’t imagine how grateful every human being would be, if they realize that for you to exist, trillions and trillions and trillions of sub atomic particles have to be in agreement. Yeah. They said Ingrid, you are you rake Irene all about you are a divine intention. Wow, Rick. So now when I see you when I see anybody when I see this pen when I see a glass of water, I am like wow, the seas the vining tension. Imagine that gratitude these water exists for me to drink. Can trillions of particles agree for me to make this water and drink it? Wow.
RICK: Yeah, it’s beautiful to see life as a divine play like that. Here’s a quote from your book, you say when you think that you are too much remember that you are but a speck of dust in the vast universe. And when you feel like you were nothing, remember that you are as whole as the universe. And then you mentioned seeing entire communities of microorganisms in a single drop of seawater brought you to recognize the the vastness of this universe. But it’s beautiful to consider that in every little drop of water or every little anything, there is just a vast display of intelligence and that intelligence just pervades the entire vast universe, every cubic centimeter of it, it’s just full of that. Full Potential of, you know, intelligence and organizing power. Yes, we can merge with that.
INGRID: existence itself, but life itself is like wha, so the United States non grata. Wow, they know, now you can communicate with everything, with all leave levels of being with yourself.
RICK: Yeah. So you mentioned during our talk that you do one on one conversations with people is, what else you do? How can people connect with you or get involved in any way?
INGRID: Yeah, that’s good. I do that they want to want on I am also creating a community. Because people are asking me, especially all the people I do sessions with, they’re like, how can we keep in touch with you? Because I of course, trying to answer emails for every person is impossible. So now I’m creating a community where I’m planning to do like two meetings a month and answer questions and interact that way. So that that is in the process of being and I also do speaking engagements and workshops. So all that I’m available
RICK: for us to do speaking engagements before we all had to go underground.
INGRID: Now they are all in zoom.
RICK: All right, well, thanks so much Ingrid, and really enjoyed spending time with you. And thanks to those who’ve been listening or watching. Next week, I’ll be totally shifting gears and speaking with three guys who run the conspiratorial ality podcast, which is about the strange infiltration of conspiracy theory thinking and queueing on and stuff like that into spiritual communities, which has been really quite widespread and deep. So we’re going to talk about that subject, which is one of my bizarre fascinations. Anyway, thanks a lot, Ingrid. And thanks to those who’ve been watching and we’ll see you next one. Thanks so much, Rick. Talk to you later. Talk to you later.