Sue Morter Transcript: Energy Codes, Embodiment, and Bioenergetic Theory

Sue Morter Interview

Summary

Sue Morter describes how early perceptions of energy and later meditation experiences shaped her approach to spiritual development and self-healing. The discussion explores integrating heart and mind, honoring personal integrity, and using embodied practices to access a deeper sense of self.

Questions This Interview Explores

• How can meditation help someone reconnect with their deeper self?
• How can spiritual practice bring the heart and mind into balance?
• Can early childhood experiences of energy or expanded awareness return later in life?
• How can you tell whether a spiritual teacher or path is aligned with integrity?

Key takeaways

• A sense of wonder and awe can open attention to experiences beyond ordinary perception.
• Early spiritual sensitivity may be suppressed, but can become accessible again through practice.
• Devotion and a heartfelt connection can make meditation more effective for some people.
• Spiritual growth should involve the body, heart, and intellect rather than developing one part alone.
• Integrity and authenticity provide a sound basis for spiritual work and service.

Transcript

Rick: Welcome to Buddha at the Gas Pump. My name is Rick Archer. Buddha at the Gas Pump is an ongoing series of conversations with spiritually awakening people. We’ve done well over 500 of them now. If this is new to you and you’d like to check out previous ones, just go to batgap.com—B-A-T-G-A-P—and look under the Past Interviews menu. This program is made possible through the support of appreciative listeners and viewers. So, if you appreciate it and would like to help support it, there’s a PayPal button on every page of the website. My guest today is Dr. Sue Morter. Hi, Sue.

Sue: Hello there. Nice to see you.

Rick: Nice to see you. I’ve been reading your book, The Energy Codes , this week and enjoying it a lot. So, we’ll be discussing that. Let me just read some of your bio. I might skim through some of it because you’re going to tell us all this stuff anyway. Sue is a master of bioenergetic theory and a quantum field visionary. I’m going to have her define those terms in a bit. She utilizes the embodiment of high-frequency energy patterns to activate full human potential through seminars, retreats, and presentations. She illuminates the relationship between quantum science and energy medicine, elevating human consciousness into life mastery. Dr. Sue is the USA Today bestselling, number-one bestselling LA Times and number-one Amazon bestselling author of The Energy Codes: The Seven-Step System to Awaken Your Spirit, Heal Your Body, and Live Your Best Life . Through the Energy Codes, Dr.

Sue provides techniques to activate untapped energy and neurocircuitry in the body, power human potential, and become one’s true essential self. Dr. Sue is the founder and creator of the globally taught coursework, the Energy Codes, a multi-level body of work on personal and spiritual development. She also created Body Awake RYT-200, a certified yoga program. What does RYT stand for?

Sue: It’s a registered yoga teacher registration.

Rick: Oh, okay. That’s like a PhD or MA, okay. Good. And as co-creator of the Bioenergetic Synchronization Technique, she has served on professional licensing boards, providing guidance to healthcare practitioners on integrative approaches to healthcare leadership. She is also adjunct faculty at two medical schools: Michigan State University and an AAU school, classified as one of the top 100 universities in the world. She is the host of Gaia TV’s Healing Matrix and co-host of Your Year of Miracles lifestyle training. She was recently recognized for her outstanding achievements as an honored member of the Transformational Leadership Council.

Oh, there’s more. I’m reading it all after all. In addition to that, she founded the Morter Health Center in 1987 and is founder and visionary of the Morter Institute for Bioenergetics, an organization committed to teaching individuals self-healing techniques, with an inner-wisdom-based approach to life based on quantum science and higher consciousness, with three distinct schools representing the unification of mind, body, and spirit: the School of Energy Medicine, the School of BodyAwake Yoga, and the School for Higher Consciousness and Personal Development. She provides tools and avenues to empower the global community to discover and embody a joyful, inspired life from the true soulful self.

Right, I was going to skim that, but I kind of got into it and decided to read the whole thing. One thing—several impressions I got from reading your book: first of all, you had some very profound experiences starting at a young age, which we’ll be talking about, and on the basis of that, you have evolved and designed a whole system that can help others experience what you’ve experienced in their own way. And I really liked that, because a lot of times people talk from their level of experience and people listen from their level of experience, and never the twain shall meet. There’s just not a really good connection. Some people sort of put down techniques and practices and so on. I’ve always been kind of a technique guy myself, and it has served me well. I think most people do need some kind of practice.

And I’m kind of impressed by the way you’ve evolved a whole system of practices based on ancient wisdom, but also kind of interpreted it for modern society and modern times. Judging from what I’ve been reading, it’s been very influential and transformational for people. So that’s great.

There’s actually a difference in Indian terminology between a rishi and a maharishi. I’m not suggesting that you’re a maharishi, but a rishi is somebody who cognizes the truth, and a maharishi is somebody who cognizes it and can impart it to others in a practical way that will enable them to realize it for themselves. So, I think you do that in a very effective way.

Sue: Thank you, Rick. It is definitely an inborn disposition. As long as I can remember, I was drawn to share whatever it was that I was knowing, even prior to these illuminating experiences that began as I started meditating. I always found myself in the role of a teaching assistant or a teacher in some fashion all my life. So, it is definitely my purpose on the planet.

Rick: Yeah, some of us are just wired to do that.

Sue: Yeah.

Rick: And I bet most times when you do an interview, people start you out with that profound experience you had when you were in a big group meditation and you hovered above the earth and all that. We’ll get to that. But actually, you started having things much earlier. For instance, in your book, you talk about when you were six years old, you were playing in a creek bed and you had some profound experience. Could you elaborate on that one?

Sue: Yes. We had a creek right across the street from our house, in a pasture where my father had cattle—just a few cows. I would always go over there and just kind of hang out. I was reaching forward at the base of the creek bed, climbing down in there. This golden, shimmering light was glistening off the surface of the water, as the sun reflects. As I reached forward, I was kind of messing with these little tadpoles that were just hatching. Some of them were swimming about, and I was fascinated with that process, in a state of real wonder and kind of awe-struck.

I mention that because I now think, in retrospect, that those vibrational frequencies of wonder and awe are a significant ingredient in our ability to pierce through veils and live in a multidimensional realm. So, this is what happened for me then. At the time, I didn’t have any context for it. But I remember reaching my hand forward with this little stick to just kind of toss around the leaves and such. This glowing off the surface of my hand was more pronounced than the shimmering of the water underneath it. I could see that when I moved my hand, this entire energy field, this radiance, would move along with my movements.

I started to think, “I wonder if I move my hand that way…” That’s as far as I got in my mind. The field would kind of go that way and nearly carry my hand with it. It wasn’t that, when I was watching it, I was moving and then this energy field would come after. It was almost this intentional field that was causing or directing the physical action. Now, I wasn’t a scientist, and I certainly wasn’t trained at the time, but I was very aware of what was happening there. It had my attention. I then started noticing that I could see energy fields around people and pets, and anything that was alive—even the animals there. I grew up on a farm, and the cows and the horses would have this energy field around them that I was constantly marveling over.

Rick: Yeah. And you thought at the time that everybody saw that, and you eventually discovered that they didn’t.

Sue: Yes, I would talk about it. You know, “What’s that yellow thing that follows Dad around when he’s talking, and what’s that orange thing coming off the cows?” My parents’ eyes would get big, and they’d kind of look at each other. So, little by little, I pieced together, especially when I went to school, that people weren’t talking about these kinds of things.

I remember consciously shutting it down, just thinking, “I’m making these people uncomfortable, and that’s making me uncomfortable. So, I’m not going to do this thing. I guess that’s not what we do.” The way we learned about manners and decorum, or a way of functioning in society, it had that kind of feeling to it. I just kind of corralled it, to the point that I actually later wasn’t able to retrieve it. Maybe 10 or 15 years later, I wanted to get that back, and I never could, until many years later, when I had these meditation experiences that started to light things up, and suddenly that returned.

But in those interim years, I pretty much wondered if I’d been imagining it or making it up. Because I couldn’t get it back, it was like, “Gosh, I was young. Maybe that wasn’t really real.” And then, lo and behold, it reinstated, restored itself many years later—probably 20.

Rick: I’ve interviewed quite a few people. The reason I’m interviewing them is that they’ve now had some kind of spiritual blossoming, but they say they had the kind of stuff you were talking about when they were about that age—five or six—and sometimes experienced auras or angels, or felt like they were in unity consciousness or something.

Then, as they got a little older, it started to slip away, whether they wanted it to or not. They went through their crazy teenage years and so on. Often, the usual pattern is that toward the end of their teens or early 20s, they begin to want to rediscover that and find out what it was, and then that gets them going. Eventually it unfolds.

My theory—let’s hear yours, too—is that we come into this life at different levels of consciousness, or different levels of evolution. It’s not surprising that people who had some kind of profound spiritual awakening a little bit later in life were fairly highly evolved as children. It just took a little while to mature.

My theory—let’s hear yours, too—is that we come into this life at different levels of consciousness, or different levels of evolution. It’s not surprising that people who had some kind of profound spiritual awakening a little bit later in life were fairly highly evolved as children. It just took a little while to mature.

Sue: Definitely. I definitely know that I picked up where I left off. I came in very lucid. I couldn’t reconcile how what I was knowing, even though I wasn’t articulating it—there was a knowing—and when I didn’t meet with that same realm, that same reality, in front of me, the people, the places, the circumstances didn’t match vibrationally what I really perceived as real. I began to question, “Something’s awry here. Something’s discordant.”

And as I now feel the soul is going to do for purposes of its own refinement and polishing, I questioned myself, rather than grounding in that and revealing it outwardly into the world. Now we have knowings and stories of those who have been able to sustain that and come out teaching at 11, 12, and 14 years old, who have made tremendous inroads in our spiritual history.

However, I receded inward and just kind of sheltered that. I developed a way of being in the outer world that was very hesitant and questioning of the self, and translated that into shyness or intimidation and such. What I know is that, in the years since then, the people I’ve been working with who have felt suppressed or hesitant in life, or have been one of the quiet ones in the corner most of their lives, can actually access this deeper knowing pretty readily when we start tapping into it and inquiring about it.

Once given permission to connect the dots, connect some circuitry around that, and start presenting it—re-presenting it—to the surface of their lives, they find that they have quite a tremendous transformation in a relatively short period of time. It was sitting there, just waiting to be tapped, and that tapping can’t happen until it can. As it does, we start recognizing this True Self that is our birthright.

So, yes, I do. You mentioned earlier about different levels of consciousness and different levels of operation for different people. I do feel that some of us are not here doing that at this time; we’re here getting our feet wet and really grounding ourselves in the physical. In my experience, this is the person who doesn’t really want to have anything to do with a conversation about spirituality and deep inquiry. They’re really more, “Rubber meets the road. Give me something tangible and physical to work with.”

I feel that they are also on the same path. They’re just focusing on a very anchoring, grounding phase of it, and are doing their spiritual practice in their own way. It just looks different from someone who is operating with it on a conscious, cognitive level.

Rick: Sure. St. Teresa of Avila said, “It appears that God Himself is on the journey.” So, I would say that everything from amoebas to God is on the journey.

Sue: Journey. Yes.

Rick: And obviously, all beings are just at different stages of it. But there’s this evolutionary current that we more or less flow along with. At one point a few minutes ago, you said you came in where you left off, which implies reincarnation, which I think you and I are both totally comfortable with. The idea there is that whatever level of consciousness we achieve in a particular lifetime, when this vehicle no longer becomes sustainable, we pick up a new vehicle, and we pretty much continue from where we left off.

Sue: Yes, yes. And so then people will often ask, “Does that mean that you believe in past lives?” I kind of play with that and say, “Well, actually, no.” Then it’s confusing, because we’re talking about multiple experiences, et cetera. I say that I really feel there’s one life that we’re constantly living in.

Rick: Well, that’s a good way of putting it.

Sue: This physical expression, and then we move out of it, and then add it in, but the life itself never stops. And so it’s comforting for someone to kind of recognize, “Okay, so I’m actually not going to die.” And a wonderful thing to proceed.

Rick: That’s a nice way of explaining it, because obviously seeing past lives makes it sound like life somehow stopped and then started again. What you’re saying is that life is a continuum, but it just kind of goes in and out of different expressions or different forms.

Sue: Yes. So I would be alive here, and then I would be alive elsewhere, and then I would be alive here, and then, I would guess, elsewhere. I always feel this sigh of relief in the room when we start speaking about it that way. It’s like something connects in the consciousness and the subconsciousness of the group of people. It has tied together many life experiences that I’ve had and memories that I have of having been here before.

Rick: Yeah. What age in this life, or this expression, or whatever we want to call it, did you consciously start seeking again? In your 20s, or something?

Sue: Yes. My parents were both very interesting people. My father was a pioneer in energy medicine. He was very interested in how people heal, when they heal, and why they don’t when they don’t. It was all nature-based and involved working with the nervous system, the electromagnetism of the body, and so forth. My mother was very into astrology and spiritual psychology, and just very curious about all of that.

So I grew up inside those kinds of conversations and influences. Even when I was too young to understand it, the energetic was there; the backdrop was there. I was actually very curious around the ages of 10, 11, 12, and 13. I can remember looking between the lines and wondering what it was all about, and watching the crowd at school do what they did. Being shy and kind of hiding, I observed a lot. So I could see patterns and trends and tendencies. It was a curiosity that I now consider to be the beginnings of me pursuing this path on a more conscious level.

I was drawn to books that would describe it, but not so much to a spiritual tradition. It was more the science of it and the possibility of thought and beliefs and the creation of realities in those terms. It was later that it became part of more of a spiritual tradition.

The way I entered into meditation isn’t the way that everyone does. Some people just start working with mindfulness and meditation from that perspective, and some people go into that world as a devotee, working with teachers and the passing down of traditions and such. That happened to be the way it literally unfolded in my life. I do feel that it played a role in my ability to open to the things that I eventually opened to, and continue to open to, because of this heart-based devotional piece.

I feel that the energetic of devotion itself, and the role of honoring, reverie, reverence, and sacredness—those frequencies in my being, my awareness, and my heart—connected to my attention, my consistency, and my willingness to do whatever it took to do right by the teaching or the teacher. That piece played a role for me. It caused the heart to be infused into the efforts, if you will, for lack of a better word at this moment, of putting intention on the meditative piece.

I just tried to sit and meditate, which I had actually tried a few times prior. Nothing happened for me. Yet when I was kind of swept into this world where there were teachers and ceremony and sacred ritual, which was beautiful and enhancing this heart-based world, something very different happened very quickly, almost instantaneously, for me. When the heart and the mind seemed to be so infused together, it gave a different quality to stilling my mind and allowing something to be accessible that I had not been able to tap before.

Rick: That’s great. Do you mind saying what this group was?

Sue: I really can’t, because as I got further into it, I found that there was a lack of integrity in some things that were happening. During the original years when I started teaching, I never shared the names, but I shared some of the stories, because it was paramount to me that integrity be part of everything that was happening in the groups that started gathering around me. It became, “We can do this, but it has to be like this, and this, and this,” in order for me to be comfortable bringing this realm forward for people.

Some of the stories or points of reference or relativity—for example, going and collecting money to build kitchens in India—I later found out the money wasn’t being used for that at all. There were personal real estate purchases and things like that, which was just not okay.

But because I had already told the stories, I really didn’t feel good, because there was also so much good that happened in my life. I never want to do harm to the individual and the individuals who were running this organization, because it was such a gift in my life. But there were also these pieces that were just not in alignment. So I’ve always protected it, at the same time as being real about what is significant and important to me.

🕊️ Integrity, embodiment, and spiritual development

Rick: That’s great. I could almost say the very same words about what I went through: tremendous benefit and tremendous gratitude for all that, but then again, some things out of integrity. In fact, I think that experience was part of what inspired me to get on this integrity bandwagon a few years ago with a few friends.

We formed something that was initially called the Association for Professional Spiritual Teachers, but then we changed the name to the Association for Spiritual Integrity. We have an organization a lot of people have joined. There is so much lack of integrity in the spiritual world, and it’s unfortunate because I think, as you would agree, that spirituality in its pure form has a tremendous gift to offer the world and is perhaps the most critical and fundamental leverage or influence on world events.

But it gets sabotaged or hamstrung when representatives of it are out of integrity. Then people who have been studying with them get totally disillusioned, sometimes thrown off the path for who knows how long. No one’s in a position to police the whole thing, but the appreciation for integrity, I think, the more it can be enlivened in the collective consciousness of spiritual seekers—and the more they can hold their own teachers’ feet to the fire if the teacher is going off the beam—the healthier the whole thing will be, and the more effective it’ll be in producing social change.

Sue: Yes, there’s such a purity that is so powerful. And all one has to do is walk that, and it unfolds magnificently, automatically, because the power of the universe is behind it. We’re not forcing it or distorting it by having some better idea of how reality would have things be.

It’s always been a wonder to me how so much power is put into the energetics that are discordant and kind of in a distortion of sorts. There’s so much initial power that appears, but ultimately, it will never be sustainable. I always marvel about that. And I’ve made it a personal disposition, just quietly along the way, to be curious about how far integrity would take me. How far would it go? How many people could I reach, how many people could be touched, how many lives could be enhanced if all I ever did was walk the authentic path?

When people would come forward and say, “You need to do this. Everybody’s doing this in order to build your business,” or, “This is happening,” if I didn’t feel it, I was like, “Thank you, no.” A few times, I truly trusted some of the people, and then I would try it. It wasn’t ever out of integrity, but it wasn’t a heartfelt thing for me; it was more of an intellectual, analytical process. It would never work for me.

I quickly learned that my path is to just walk this and see what unfolds, see what happens, and see where your life takes you. I knew that this awakening that was starting 20 years ago with me, and these things that were just unfolding, literally visually and experientially, had a reason. I didn’t know on a conscious level exactly what I was supposed to do with it, but I knew it was significant enough that my life needed to be about that. And so that’s how it has unfolded, and it has us speaking here today.

That’s great. There’s a nice example of that in your book. I liked what you said just now, and also a few minutes ago, about the head and the heart both being involved. For you, that really worked.

Rick: That’s great. There’s a nice example of that in your book. I liked what you said just now, and also a few minutes ago, about the head and the heart both being involved. For you, that really worked.

I’ve said this before on the show, but I don’t like to use the word enlightenment because it has this static, superlative connotation. But if I were to use it, I would want to refer to people who are very holistically developed: intellect, heart, senses, all the different facets of our makeup. Very often you see lopsided development. Ken Wilber talks about lines of development that can get very out of sync with one another. But I really think it’s essential for our own well-being, the safety of our journey, and our influence on the world that we somehow achieve holistic development.

Sue: Definitely. This is one of the first things I noticed when I came into this world where there were teachers teaching and healers healing from this spiritual context. Having come out of natural health care, I was very trained up and had grown up inside of a world where the body had the ability to heal itself, our thoughts and emotions had an influence on that, and all of this was working in a collaborative fashion. So my “come from,” if you will, was very holistic in its own right at that time.

I started meditating, and almost instantly these openings started occurring for me. I was drawn to teachers. I couldn’t get enough of it when I would sit down in a room with people who were meditating. I was translating information; I knew all of it that was coming out was exactly the truth, and what I was here to be reminded of, and that it was my time to just drink this up.

And yet, I would notice that oftentimes there were extreme, obvious health issues or extreme habitual things in their lifestyle that were really out of context, or didn’t make sense to me. I thought, number one, speaking again of the integrity piece, that you had to be a good person, take care of yourself, and eat in certain ways—I don’t know, exercise, and do those kinds of things that were, in my mind at the time, appropriate for vitality in the human form.

Here I was coming across quite a different arrangement, or a different collection of obvious priorities. Then I started realizing, and I started asking. One of the teachers said to me, “If I’m a thief and I become enlightened, I’m an enlightened thief. You don’t have to be in integrity.” That was close to the moment that I started parting ways and moving in a different direction.

It was also striking to my heart space that someone could be helping. This was another individual who was a healer, and I would see people flock by the hundreds or the thousands to this individual, who was healing people in these great rooms with a tremendous, high, pristine energy. It was so evident, but there was such an extraordinary lack of vital force in the body of this person who was doing this.

It was also striking to my heart space that someone could be helping. This was another individual who was a healer, and I would see people flock by the hundreds or the thousands to this individual, who was healing people in these great rooms with a tremendous, high, pristine energy. It was so evident, but there was such an extraordinary lack of vital force in the body of this person who was doing this.

Rick: Where did all that pristine energy come from if there was this lack of vital force?

Sue: From running rooms of people who were holding the space for the work.

Rick: So the group itself was creating that energy, but this guy was not.

Not. However, he had these gifts, or talents, these siddhis that were moving energies in ways that most people cannot. It had my attention; I was captivated by it, and also disheartened by the integration piece not being there.

Sue: Not. However, he had these gifts, or talents, these siddhis that were moving energies in ways that most people cannot. It had my attention; I was captivated by it, and also disheartened by the integration piece not being there.

Interestingly, I can’t say that was causal to why my interest became what it was, but simultaneously with my interest in integrating these experiences that I was starting to have in these higher realms, I became very interested in being able to repeat them on command. My mind was trained in such a way that I had to figure out what I was doing that allowed me to get there.

How Undoing and Grounding Opened Awareness

After many years, I figured out it was not the doing; it was the undoing, the not doing, that allowed that opening to be present and for me to become aware of it. What I recognized in those years was that I had to be more in my body and more integrated myself in order to have access to tapping these frequencies on a regular basis. Being able to sit and sense my way into that, to perceive this stillness, required more grounding for me.

After many years, I figured out it was not the doing; it was the undoing, the not doing, that allowed that opening to be present and for me to become aware of it. What I recognized in those years was that I had to be more in my body and more integrated myself in order to have access to tapping these frequencies on a regular basis. Being able to sit and sense my way into that, to perceive this stillness, required more grounding for me.

Embodiment became a focus of mine. It developed itself; it just kind of birthed itself as a realization that in order for me to tap these realms that I had shot up into, just opened up into, and to have access on a regular basis, it required not efforts for this enlightenment, as you’re speaking of it, but really more focus on embodiment: grounding myself, coming into the body, coming into the wisdom, energies, coming into the having frequencies rather than the wanting frequencies, and coming into the loving presence rather than the trying, efforting, seeking channels.

Landing in the body in more and more ways is how I started interpreting it. I started sensing, “Wow, I’m actually more here, and that’s what allows me to be there. And there becomes here when I do that.” It started to change my perception.

I hadn’t joined these meditation groups because I was seeking enlightenment. I didn’t even know about enlightenment. I actually began participating in it in an attempt to get stress relief. I was drawn to meditation for stress relief. I met someone who was already in the groups meditating, and they took me there. In the midst of that relationship, I found myself in the face of these meditation retreats and so on. It was as much for the relationship as it was for stress relief. Learning to meditate was just where I was coming from at the time.

In the midst of that, I started having these openings. I’m so grateful that I didn’t know this idea of enlightenment was a goal to pursue, because I was very goal-oriented at that point in my life, and I would have started pursuing it. To the degree that I know myself, I believe I would have made it harder on myself, because I would have taken it on as a project: “I have to get this done. I have to accomplish this. I have to do this.”

I didn’t even really know that it was something to accomplish or achieve. It never has felt like that to me. I think had I perceived it as such, I might have gotten lost in the pursuit and dialed into so much trying and efforting that it might have taken me longer to ever sit down, relax, allow, and not do, rather than how I had accomplished the other things in my life that I had accomplished.

Rick: Some good points in there. First of all, I think stress relief is a perfectly legitimate reason to get involved in meditation or yoga or something like that. Sometimes people criticize it and say, “Oh, it’s just superficial and worldly,” or whatever. But why not? Is stress relief not a good thing? And next thing you know, you’re having beautiful, profound experiences. So whatever gets you started.

Sue: Exactly. Yeah, I totally agree.

Rick: The thing about grounding, I think, is really good too. It reminds me of an old Steven Wright joke where he said, “I broke up with my girlfriend because I wasn’t really into meditation, and she really wasn’t into being alive.” Like a sailboat has to have a big, heavy keel down beneath the water in order not to tip over, and sometimes people don’t establish that keel in their life. They can get very top-heavy and very sort of airy-fairy and ungrounded. That’s not what you’re looking for. You really want an integrated development in which you can maybe have your head in the clouds, but also have your feet on the ground, and then span the distance between them.

Sue: Exactly, yes, I completely concur. You know the analogy of the roots and the tree: they can’t really grow taller without deepening the roots, rather like the foundation of a skyscraper or whatever. Yes, and I love the keel and the sailboat. I love to sail; it’s one of my lessons in life in appreciating and working with, collaborating with, nature and the forces of nature—the wind and the water. And that power that you can feel when you’re integrating those elements at the same time, that’s really what we’re speaking about.

Rick: Yeah. So you’ve alluded to these experiences you started having. Let’s get into some of those. You had this real lollapalooza experience on some retreat. Talk about that.

Sue: Sure. So I had been kind of drawn into this community that we spoke of earlier. I was pulled in closely, quickly, to the teacher and was serving as a personal assistant very quickly—just did it like, blink, blink.

My disposition in life was to serve, to give, to kind of overgive, and to always be trying to do the right thing and help out. It was a little outside of the self, the degree to which I was functioning that way. Perhaps this teacher was on to that and gave me a list of things to do that were impossible to do in the amount of time I was given.

I was running around behind the scenes at this retreat, taking care of all sorts of things, making sure of this and monitoring that, going and purchasing this for this, and just literally running around in the back hallways with sweat running down my back to try to make this experience beautiful for 300 people sitting in the ballroom, with the music playing, the candles lit, and the draperies blowing in the breeze. I got past the door on my way on one of my errands and realized…

Rick: You’re actually a member of this retreat; you just got kind of drawn into all this work, right?

Sue: I was. I was paying to do the work.

Rick: Paying to do that, yeah.

Sue: Yes. It wasn’t very right. So I realized that, and in this one particular moment, it hit me. I looked at the list, and I looked at it, and I looked in the door and saw these people having a beautiful time. And it just landed for me. I said a couple of expletives, actually, in very graphic form, that got the job done and cut through something in my own consciousness in a couple of words. I threw the list away and walked into the room and just said, “I’m just gonna go have me a meditation, by golly.”

So I sat down, and I was new to the whole thing. I didn’t understand Sanskrit. They were chanting Sanskrit terms, and it was “Om Namah Shivaya.” It was the slowest version of that you can imagine, and I wasn’t used to singing or letting anything come out of my mouth like that. I would have thought of that as singing at the time. That’s where I was.

I sat down, and they were holding these tones longer than I could because I was a very shallow breather and a perfectionist, trying to compensate for my shyness in the world. Just overcoming the overcoming and holding these tones, I had to concentrate with all that I had, everything that I had, which I think was an important ingredient in the moment. Sanskrit tones, “Om Namah Shivaya,” making these sounds that are obviously opening and creating frequencies inside the system, with a stilling effect on the mind and an enlivening effect on the essence, on the energy system beneath.

I was having to breathe slower than I ever breathed, and I was having to take deeper breaths than I normally would in order to stay in tandem and do the right thing with everybody around me who was chanting the right way. I was trying to learn how to do that.

Another active ingredient, maybe, was that I was taking a claim for myself. I was like, “I’m not gonna go do this thing that I always do of taking care of everybody else. I’m gonna sit down and do something for me.” That wasn’t my general come-from in life. It was something I had to consciously learn how to do. So this was a moment where that was starting to find a balance.

All these ingredients were there, and the collective, the group energy, was there. I got through a few rounds of this “Om Namah Shivaya,” and boom, I disappeared into another realm. I was in a light so brilliantly bright; it was 10 times brighter than the brightest day in the desert that I had ever seen. I could see 360 degrees around, above, below—everything, a sphere. I could just see it all instantly.

I could perceive the Earth. I could see the Earth beneath me; it was about the size of a marble. I was me, but I wasn’t in a body. I was embedded into the Earth up to what felt like it would have been my knees, but it didn’t have me. So it was just this ray of light, this golden, citrine-colored ray of conscious light, and this brilliant light above the horizon, and then bright light below the horizon.

Every time I took a breath, this horizon was a pink, beautiful, iridescent, translucent blanket of light that would rise up on my inhale as I was chanting and drop back to its resting place on my exhale. With each inhale, these giant wings of a stingray, just swimming in slow motion under the ocean—that’s what it looked like behind me, beside me, in front of me, everything equal. And I knew that this brilliant light overhead was becoming love as it passed through my own system, and that I was breathing love down this ray to the Earth.

I knew in that instant that that is what we are, that’s the only thing that’s happening: that we are transmuting light into love and creating an existence here in this physical dimension. And I had free will in this moment because I could choose to breathe big or small, and this blanket would respond in accordance with that. I knew that the degree to which we allow ourselves to breathe freely is proportional to the amount of light that is being transduced into love in our systems.

I knew in that instant that that is what we are, that’s the only thing that’s happening: that we are transmuting light into love and creating an existence here in this physical dimension. And I had free will in this moment because I could choose to breathe big or small, and this blanket would respond in accordance with that. I knew that the degree to which we allow ourselves to breathe freely is proportional to the amount of light that is being transduced into love in our systems.

I don’t know how long I was there in that initial moment. When I dropped back into my body and knew that I was sitting there in this room and could hear people chanting, I opened my eyes, and I was looking from a different place than I was looking from when I initially closed them. I happened to look to the front of the room, and the teacher was sitting there, eyes locked right on me, with this huge smile, like, “I got you.” And I was like, “Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, you got me.” That had me completely.

There was so much bliss and so much emanation of an exalted divine presence. As I was in this body, I could feel the radiance again that I had seen when I was a kid in the creek bed. I could see it emanating off of my own face and my hands, and everyone else, and could once again see these energies in the spaces between the people who were in the room with me.

I knew that my life was changed forever, in that I now had a reference point that was my new baseline, that everything would be relative to. I’ll just add briefly to this: In the days that followed, there was a tremendous time of integration for me. It was a big challenge to try to pick up on the life that I’d been living before.

One of the things that I noticed, which is so interesting to me, is that when I would look at people in the room with me, they would look like a photograph. The difference between picking up a photograph of someone versus sitting right next to them and seeing them in the 3D version, versus the two-dimensional version in a photograph—how flat that looks. People walking around in this world looked as flat as a photograph, relative to the multidimensional perception that my field had been exposed to, or awakened to in some way.

It was quite interesting for me to try to navigate how close I was to someone, where they were and where they were not, because I was just trying to recalibrate, seeing through this energy field and seeing differently, dimensionally, after that.

Rick: Let’s talk more about the days and weeks after that big experience. In your book, you said that it took you about a week before you had integrated that energy enough so that you could sit and stand and walk around. So what was happening in that week before you could even do those things?

Sue: Yes, I was lying in a bed, and I didn’t care if I ever, ever opened my eyes and came out of that bed, because we were still on the retreat that I was in. Well, what happened was I came back, just clamped down, and got home from the retreat. As I got back from the retreat, people were waiting for me at the airport because they had heard that I had this experience, and the message from the other end was, “Don’t let her get on a plane.” I didn’t get the message. I’d caught a 5 a.m. flight, and so it was all that I could do. Someone was flying with me, but I was just muscling up to simulate the same effort I’d put into that.

I remember feeling like I was trying to lift a dumbbell with 150 pounds on it. That’s how much effort you would put into that physically. I was trying to contain myself in a body, or I would just bliss out and get lost at the airport, which I was doing.

Rick: You were in India when this happened? Having to come back from India?

Sue: No, I was in the United States.

When I got home, there were people at the airport helping me get to the house, and boom, when I lay down in my bed, I just let go. I was able to just let go again. There was this beautiful woman who would wake me up a couple of times a day and give me something to eat that the teacher and some of the assistants were recommending, and make sure that I was drinking water.

I was like I was drunk, like I was completely drugged or just totally blissed out. I haven’t ever taken anything psychotropic or psychedelic in that way. I would lie there in this bliss, and then I would feel somebody touching my body, trying to stir me. I would have to compress myself, is what it felt like, just squeeze myself into this place, this presence here. And it would be blissful, but vibrating—just so much vibration.

As each day passed, I would be out all day and all night, just in these realms where there was nothing, or there would be kind of a cosmic feeling, similar to what we see when we look at nebulae and stardust and these cosmic clouds in astronomy photographs of outer space. Sometimes it would be like that, filled with colors or sounds. Now I have a greater context for those things, but at the time, it was just a blissful swirl of everything and nothingness.

Then I got a call from the teacher about four or five days later. They held up the phone for me, and I just remember hearing, “It’s time for you to ground these energies. It’s really time for you to ground this.” The encouragement was to get into a salt bath and just start moving my body and that type of thing. So that’s what I did, with a little help from my friends. As soon as I started doing that, things began to integrate enough so I could walk around the house.

But I didn’t want to hear music, radio, people talking, or the television—forget about it. It felt so invasive and so intense to my system, which had just been opened up into such an expansive state. I went to work maybe a week later for half a day, and I would just go into my treatment room and work with my patients. They would leave and another one would come in, and I would just kind of park myself for the several weeks to come.

We would laugh about it. The patients knew what was happening; many of them knew what was going on. They were happy to make their way into the treatment room themselves instead of being greeted and handled normally, because they would joke, “Just being in the room with you at this point is going to be a session for me.”

Learning how to do the doing of life again was fine. But it was very obvious to me, the harshness that we have adopted and adapted as the norm, the baseline inside our human existence. The energies we’ve learned to tolerate, that we tune out; so many layers of our reality, in order to function in our world. It’s no wonder that people have a hard time dropping back down into that state of presence that is the true self, without the help of the body.

It was the embodiment piece that allowed me to find my way here in this world, with the buffering and the filtering that the body itself does. Bringing my awareness into the body was the saving grace. It allowed me not only to become functional again, but, really, I found, super functional. I became much more capable, with much more energy, much more endurance, much more vitality, and much more capacity to perceive what was necessary, what was appropriate, who we are, what’s going on here.

There was a level of discernment that just came forward without an effort, all because I felt like I was in my body for the first time in my life, and that the body was contributing to the ability to translate this really cosmic proportion of intelligence that we are.

Rick: That’s pretty cool. As you were speaking, I was kind of thinking of that line, that scene in When Harry Met Sally, where Meg Ryan is having this experience at the table with Billy Crystal, and then someone at the next table says, “I’ll have what she’s having.”

Sue: Whatever that is.

Rick: But it’s really interesting. And like you say, when you finally integrated this thing, the amount of energy that you found you had, and that you still have, was orders of magnitude above what it had been before this. If you’ve ever encountered one of these great beings, like Amma, whose picture I have over my shoulder, you think, “How does she do it?” I mean, how does she sit there for literally 24 hours without getting off the couch, hugging 150,000 people or something like that, without dropping down, and still look really bright when she gets up—maybe even more so?

I know you’d like to talk about physics and stuff. Physicists say that at the level of the vacuum state, there’s more potential, unexpressed energy in a cubic centimeter than there is in the whole manifest universe at a more superficial level. Whatever the vacuum state of the unified field, or anything else, may be, we are that. I mean, it’s our essence, as well as the essence of everything else. Ultimately, that’s what we are. It seems that realizing that is tantamount to tapping into that energy and being able to be a conduit for it, to whatever extent this body can handle it. Obviously, initially it was maybe too much to handle for you. But then you adapted to it, you adjusted to it, and the rest has been cruising along for you.

Sue: It’s been amazing. I’ve often described it this way: People ask me, “How do you do what you do? How do you do that?” I used to be on a plane two or three times a week, flying to different cities, constantly doing things, and then just stepping in and teaching all day for five, six, or seven days in a row. At the end of it, I could begin again. It’s always that way.

People ask, “How do you do that? Where do you get the energy?” My knee-jerk response was, “I’m not using my energy.” I mean, ultimately, it is mine; it’s ours. But it’s not this separate self, this isolated entity, that has to generate its own energy. It’s like I borrow it, I utilize it, I give it back, I try to improve upon it as I can while I’m expressing in the world, and I just get some more and give it back again. It literally feels like an open channel.

That’s become part of the teaching of the techniques. The approach I utilize is to teach people to start perceiving themselves as this open channel that is receiving and utilizing, then releasing; receiving and utilizing and giving it back. That way, we’re not walking around trying to muster up the gumption or find the energy to do something. Now, I will say that the more analytical thinking one does, the harder it is to do that. So, we do have to cultivate this sense of presence and observation, and just kind of kick into neutral and be here, in order for that to happen consistently.

Rick: Yeah, and as you say in your book, not only are most people not tapped into this amazing energy, but also, perhaps because of that, their whole system—mind and body—functions very inefficiently. There’s a lot of mental chatter that doesn’t contribute to anything, and corresponding physiological agitation that is not an efficient way to function. So, we not only don’t have that infinite access to infinite energy, but we’re consuming a lot of the energy we do have with fruitless mental and physical activities.

Sue: Absolutely. People have no idea how much energy they consume by weighing out their options, being trapped in indecision, writing stories about people’s intentions, predicting their future, or regretting their past. There is so much energy consumed in those uses of the mind that it’s then not available to be felt and perceived in a strong enough concentration to be channeled into this toric field flow that I’m speaking about, which became obvious to me as what my system was running on.

They can’t ever perceive the energy flowing through their system because it’s so dissipated into these mental activities and emotional consumptions, regrets, remorse, and all of that.

Rick: Spinning our wheels.

Sue: It disperses it, yes. It’s spinning wheels, and it’s just flying off of us instead of us containing it, holding it, having it, appreciating it, and feeling it, so that the sensory nervous system can start to perceive and appreciate it.

Once people start being able to feel the energy that they truly are, the sensory nervous system—the mind—can perceive it and develop an appreciation for it, which then magnifies it and makes it even more robust and obvious to us. Then it becomes something we can work with. We easily choose not to overthink a situation because we can feel it robbing our energy. We choose not to predict, analyze, or write a story about something because we feel our energy being consumed outwardly and now unavailable to utilize in the ways we came here to utilize it—in the ways we came here to awaken to it.

Rick: Yeah, there’s a verse in the Gita that goes, “For many-branched and endlessly diverse are the intellects of the irresolute, but the resolute intellect is one-pointed.” It always reminds me of a bicycle wheel, where ordinarily people’s attention is scattered like the spokes, in every direction. They’re out on one spoke or another, jumping around without any center. But the resolute intellect, someone who is established there, is more like the hub. The hub doesn’t actually move much compared to the spokes. The spokes are going around like this; the hub is in more silent space. From its perspective, it hasn’t gone out and gotten lost on one spoke or another; it’s kind of the source. Our base is literally the hub of all the spokes. If we can function from there, obviously our activity can be much more efficient, because we’re not literally scattered.

Sue: And we can sense in an instant if something is worth our attention or not. Yeah, don’t leave home if we’re here. But we roll our attention out there and look, while I’m still sitting here. Instead of me going over there to that thing, I stay on the self and observe. Then we can tell in an instant if that’s something that is really a vibrational frequency that I am. Does it match? Does it match the real me? Because we can maintain that reference point.

But if we throw all of our attention over there onto the outer edge of the spoke, if you will, we’re over there on the object instead of on the self. We’re now out there in the relative, and it’s really tough to maintain a reference point of self when we’re completely caught up in the movie, when we’re really caught up out there in the material world, in the manifest.

Rick: Yeah, and another element of it, which I noted from your book, is that after this big breakthrough, you had a lot more of what we might call support of nature. Things were just kind of working out for you in really interesting ways, one might almost say miraculous. You also already referred to intuition. One quick comment on that is, I do think—and you probably agree—that there’s an all-pervading intelligence that orchestrates the universe. If we actually become one with that, even though we may not know everything—that’s not humanly possible—then, by residing there, that intelligence which orchestrates everything orchestrates things for us.

So if we have a desire, it’s basically a cosmic desire. It’s a desire of that cosmic intelligence, just being reflected through our individuality. And so it gets the support of the cosmos, rather than relying exclusively on our little, tiny individual efforts.

Sue: Beautiful. I love it, and yes, this is exactly how I would describe it. The desires that rise are supported by the cosmos because they’re rising from the cosmos, instead of this separate individual self coming up with some idea and then trying to go out and find support for it. The things that occur are the things that are destined to materialize in the manifest, and they become the desires because we’re tapped into that, so we’re not losing that connection.

As such, it generates what I refer to as this wave of grace, which just moves through my life experience. People marvel about it, and I marvel about it at the same time. It happens so consistently, including with the projects I engage in every day. I’m in the middle of renovating a home that I just moved into, and people are showing up out of nowhere who have the skills or abilities at a time when those things aren’t readily available. People are marveling that these things are happening in record time and with record ease, and they scratch their heads as they walk past me in the hallway.

Rick: Yeah, support of nature. Another thing that happens, which I think I heard you say something about, is that sometimes when things don’t work out, it’s actually to your advantage. Today, I took a walk in the woods, and I spent 55 minutes making a recording with somebody who had had a spiritual awakening and was wondering what to do. Then the battery in my iPod died, and the recording wasn’t saved. So I thought, “Okay, well, there must be a reason for it. I’ll make another one tomorrow.”

I don’t know—we don’t want to start reading cosmic significance into every little thing that happens. But after a while, you begin to trust the way things are orchestrated, again, by that intelligence I was referring to. You trust it because it proves itself over and over again.

Sue: Time and time again, time and time again. And the ease with which that allows life to unfold is tremendous. You didn’t get upset, and you didn’t start judging yourself in your mind: “I should have charged it. I should have known.” Those are all the things that people do in that moment, when you actually now know that the recording you make tomorrow is going to have some element or some kind of angle to it that didn’t come through today. That will come through tomorrow, or whenever that recording does happen, and it will be perfectly suited for whatever this individual is supposed to hear from you. No question.

Rick: There’s that movie with Tom Hanks, Bridge of Spies. Tom Hanks is talking to this guy who was a spy, and he’s just sitting there casually smoking a cigarette. The jig is up for him; he’s been found out. Tom Hanks says, “You could end up getting executed. Aren’t you worried?” The guy takes a puff on his cigarette and says, “Would it help?”

Sue: No amount of worry is gonna get me out of this.

⛰️ Working with the challenges of the time

Rick: A couple of questions came in. Let’s ask those, and then we’ll use that as a way of shifting gears and talking more about the Energy Codes. One is from Rita in Melbourne, Australia. She actually sent this in a few days ago, and she asked if any guests would like to answer. I thought we’d ask Sue, because she’s the next one up. She said, “I understand this is a spiritually significant time right now. How can I harness, embrace, and further action my connection with the universe, both consciously and subconsciously, in alignment with what I do every day? What changes can I expect to see, hear, or feel? What evidence will I notice?”

I think that we are being gifted at this time with a tremendous, unique circumstance: humanity has been asked to evaluate, to go home, to sit down, to not do all the things that we normally do. There’s a stillness before us that isn’t typical. And I feel that this bandwidth of the mental self is softening, is poised in more curiosity rather than being on autopilot. And so there’s a presence and an availability.

Sue: I think that we are being gifted at this time with a tremendous, unique circumstance: humanity has been asked to evaluate, to go home, to sit down, to not do all the things that we normally do. There’s a stillness before us that isn’t typical. And I feel that this bandwidth of the mental self is softening, is poised in more curiosity rather than being on autopilot. And so there’s a presence and an availability.

And how someone might capitalize on that is to just simply bring consciousness to the fact that there is a divine order to things, and that what we are all collectively being invited to do right now is in service to that. And if we will allow that to be true for us on a personal level, then we are embracing what is occurring, rather than being resistant to the fact that we have to do this, or we have to do that, or we can’t do this, or this is not happening right now.

Instead of being in resistance to it, embrace it fully. Be curious about, “How is this serving?” And even if the answer to the question doesn’t come immediately, the fact that we’re asking an open-ended question that is filled with possibility puts us in a vibrational frequency where this can serve us, instead of us dialing into the frequency of frustration and fear, or resistance or resentment that we’re unable to be as freely doing or going as we used to be.

We’re being called into another version of ourselves. And if we allow that to be the perfect right time and accept that, on a personal note, the students that I’m working with are definitely reporting this happening. They’re finding that they have a greater sense of presence and patience, that they’re healing and rejuvenating, and that they have more energy available. They have more curiosity and creativity happening because they’re actively embracing. And there are so many things that happen in the course of a day to remind us, “Oh, here’s another opportunity to do that.”

Or here’s another opportunity, if we read or watch the news and there’s something happening. It’s another opportunity that’s constantly being elevated on a conscious level for us to start to walk and talk completely differently. So, by embracing it, number one, I think that it will dial you into a field of possibility and creativity and allow for rejuvenation, the way that we’re speaking about this, of your own energies to be able to be focused now on something different than trying to strategize on how to deal with these difficult times.

Rather, just embrace them. Just assume that this is in your favor, and that it’s here for you. And by doing so, your translation of the energies happens very differently. And as such, your body physically has now more energy to work with. Results, or outcomes, of being that way with it are definitely going to be presenting things to you like what we’re describing.

You may even find that you’re closer to a divine nature, to the true self or to nature itself, or to a cosmic relationship of sorts, if we walk around recognizing that, wow, life is really different. And this is happening in my favor. And there’s something here that is here for me, that wasn’t here for me a year ago.

You begin to establish a rapport with something that used to feel out there and separate from you. And it’s through that rapport, in that relationship, that we begin to actually be able to merge with it and become a bigger state of being because of this embracing, this trust, this faith that’s right up in our face in a way that it wasn’t for the majority of our adult lives. So I’m hoping that that’s helpful. I’m not sure that I tapped into all aspects of the question.

Rick: You never can get everything, but that was good. But what about things like the pandemic and the shutdown and all that? They probably haven’t impacted you too adversely, although you can’t travel and do your seminars, but you’re doing okay, and I’m doing okay, doing what I do—I can do it from home.

But what about the person who worked in or owned a restaurant, and the restaurant has been closed down, and they’re out of money, and they’ve got kids to feed and everything? Some people are really going through it right now. And they’re also kind of on a forced retreat in a way, where people who aren’t used to retreats begin to feel very uncomfortable because they’re used to doing stuff. So how do you speak to those people?

Sue: Sure. And my heart so goes out to individuals. I have dear friends who are in these types of circumstances. And in our conversations, what they are realizing is that, for some of them, while they were doing what they were doing and it was their source of income, it really wasn’t their choice of vocation, and they’re actually in a state of reevaluation and reinvention.

And what I feel on a higher spiritual level is happening for them is that forced reevaluation, or that forced stymie of this system that was in flow, is causing this squeeze up into a higher meaning of life, and really looking to, “Who am I? What matters most?” These energies of searching and finding and reprioritizing. So many people have reported to me in conversation that they’re finding they have a greater understanding of love, and their value system is shifting. And while they’re struggling with their finances, they’re also recognizing that a reprioritization of what they thought they needed is happening.

And so, if someone is on a spiritual path, and they find themselves living in an ashram or wanting to seclude themselves, or even relinquish a lot of their worldly goods because of the energetic that consumes, and suddenly they’re being drawn into this centeredness and this alignment with their true divine nature, those things are happening voluntarily for someone who’s seeking on the path.

And what’s happening are those same sets of circumstances in mass for humanity. And while we’re meeting it with confusion and frustration, an inherent resistance, and a sense of survivor-hood, it ultimately might be drawing them into that same vertical alignment that, ultimately, in the course of their life, will be a necessity. It is a necessity for each of us.

Sometimes it doesn’t happen until the days that we are bedridden, that we are in a hospice, or that we are in serious contemplation of who we are in our moments left here on Earth. That sort of arrangement and alignment is trying to happen. And there’s a sense of desperation about it oftentimes, causing a lot of fear in the midst of one’s transition out of the physical dimension and into the spiritual realms involved in that cycling that we were speaking of earlier in our conversation.

And so, what if right now it’s breaking the seal on what we thought life was and causing us to do some of those evaluations and meet with some of that discomfort now, so that as this starts to open up again, we are aware and awake to parts of ourselves that no other set of circumstances may have generated the awareness of?

And so, as we go through the rest of our lives, a greater sense of self and this awareness is included in all of our decisions, in our actions that we are taking moving forward. And so, as we near the end of our life experience here, we already have a greater sense of self, as if we’d been on a deep spiritual path by choice. It seemingly put us there not by choice, but at some level, it accomplished what we are here to accomplish and awaken to in this realm, which is who we are, what is true, what matters most, while we’re here on this frontier of consciousness called the third dimension in a physical form.

Now, that might not speak to, “Okay, on a daily basis, here’s what you do.” And I do speak to that, but I’m just trying to give some kind of context for people who are confused and afraid, and really dealing with it on a challenge level right now: there might be a really high level of support happening here that is something that might not have met the eye under any other set of circumstances.

So, in other words, it may be that the whole world is going through a kind of phase transition or a reshuffling that is similar to what an individual may undergo as they’re transitioning into a higher state of consciousness or higher state of being.

Rick: So, in other words, it may be that the whole world is going through a kind of phase transition or a reshuffling that is similar to what an individual may undergo as they’re transitioning into a higher state of consciousness or higher state of being.

I once heard a chemist named Ilya Prigogine speak at a conference. He won the Nobel Prize in Chemistry. And he talked about how in the transition from one state to another, there’s often a sort of turbulent period. We can think of the example of caterpillar to butterfly, where it turns to mush and then the imaginal cells form it into a butterfly. So there’s often a kind of a breakdown of familiar or comfortable structures. That’s apparently necessary as a transition takes place.

I mean, look at you. You had a big experience, and then you were flat on your back for at least a week and couldn’t function, and had to gradually relearn to function. But when you did so, you were functioning in a whole different way. So maybe that’s happening to the world right now. And that might give a more positive perspective on what is otherwise a dire situation.

Sue: I do feel that it is. I inherently feel that this is a good thing, that we are having to reimagine ourselves. It is up-leveling the amount of animated, creative source energy inside the bandwidth of human consciousness. We are animating creativity and presence; we’re having to rethink things. We’re plugged in in a way that autopilot wasn’t doing a year, a year and a half ago.

As this was starting to come down, people were immediately having to respond. And then, after a few months, they were having to think, “Okay, I’ve got to get busy. I’ve got to figure this out, how to reengage.” And then, after a few months, really readjust that and deal with emotional issues that are surfacing because of frustrations and fears, and recognize how regularly we depend on thinking that we know what’s coming. We were dependent on that assumption, and clearly we didn’t know; we just thought we did. But we rode on that thinking that we knew what to anticipate each day, to some degree.

And it freed us up. So I feel that it’s cultivating a deeper level of faith and trust, and ultimately, I feel like that is introducing and acclimating us to the invisible realm. Who am I when I can’t do the things that I’m used to doing? When I don’t get to show up in the world the way I’m used to showing up, then who am I really? And what else is here in this world behind the scenes that I might be able to start to activate and work with, to put that into some tangible terms?

I’ve been working with people who have been secretly empathic all their lives, but now they’re able to come out and work with these energies because it’s accessible. They’re not doing all the things that they were doing before. They have time, they have space, they have energy, and they have awareness to tap into these things.

I’m working with people and sharing with them how to become not only the healers that they are, but to work with people remotely, because we’ve been forced to work with people remotely. And so people are tapping into talents and gifts that they never knew they had, and likely wouldn’t have pursued, given the pace that humanity was in.

So many gifts are being revealed in these invisible, behind-the-scenes, higher states of consciousness—aspect of every human being on the planet, to some degree or another. And just like everything else, the degree to which we embrace it and become curious about it is the degree to which it will serve us. The degree to which we resist it, clamp down, and contract in the face of it is the degree to which we will suffer.

And that’s not to say that if my business went away, and I owned a restaurant that I can’t bring people to, so the funds just simply aren’t there and I’m losing that, that isn’t a very real, tangible thing. But if we could say, “Okay, what if that was serving me? What would that look like? What if it was good?” Then how would I start processing everything that I’m processing? What emotions would rise up in me? What energies would I feel inside my system, any differently than how I was feeling them when I’m just in shock and resistance and emotional upheaval, and therefore perhaps even in anxiousness or depression because of it? If I were to change my perception on it, might I also change my experience and the degree to which I can benefit from this reinvention time?

Rick: Last week, I interviewed three guys who have a podcast called Conspirituality. One of the things we discussed is that, in other pandemic times and times of great social upheaval and economic collapse and things like that, conspiracy theories just seem to go wild, as if people are grasping at means of understanding what the heck is going on in their world.

This is happening now, obviously, and there are people who say the virus is a hoax. We don’t even have to go into them all. But do you have any thoughts on this? Actually, the spiritual community, which is why this word “conspirituality” was coined, seems particularly susceptible to it. I have friends in Sedona who say that maybe three-quarters of the new-agey types there are into QAnon or something related to it. Do you have any insights about this phenomenon, which I find rather baffling and disturbing?

Sue: Yes, Rick. I think it comes down to the basic human dilemma. Ultimately, I think we are here to choose; we are here to create. We are here to determine what the nature of our presence here will be. We’re here to choose that and create it.

As circumstances arise, the pressure is up, and the intensity is upon us, we again are at choice. Whether it is a hoax or real, whether it is man-made or natural, whether it is intended for this purpose or that purpose, the bottom line is: Who will you choose to be, given the circumstances that you are actually experiencing each day? Who will you choose to be? How would you choose to utilize your energies? What amount of love, presence, and good intention? What degree of action will you place upon those qualities that you are being, that you are breathing, that you are bringing? What degree of action, and in what ways, will you express and maintain your identity as a presence that is completely capable of processing everything that is before you?

Because ultimately, as we said earlier in this conversation, you’re made of the universe. There is not a single thing that you are not; you are that compressed into a body. And in waking up, you’re bringing conscious awareness to all of those vibrational frequencies. So there is nothing out here that is bigger than you, unless you choose to identify only as a fraction of who you actually are.

When we become identified as the protective personality or the false self or the egoic individual that needs to guard or fight against, then we’re subjecting ourselves to the world of duality, where we really put up our dukes and be strong and fight back. And if we can teach our minds to recognize the greatness, the magnificence of our being, then we can walk in a state of transmutation, in a state of flourishing abundance, no matter what our external circumstances are.

What we’re here to do is master the internal reality, regardless of external circumstances. We’re here to bring the absolute; we’re not here to find it, we’re here to reveal it. And because we’re not clear on that, we get really caught up in, “Is it this? Or is it that? Is it this? Or is it that?” In reality, I think the answer is yes. It is this and it is that. And who are you going to choose to be in the face of all of those possibilities?

What we’re here to do is master the internal reality, regardless of external circumstances. We’re here to bring the absolute; we’re not here to find it, we’re here to reveal it. And because we’re not clear on that, we get really caught up in, “Is it this? Or is it that? Is it this? Or is it that?” In reality, I think the answer is yes. It is this and it is that. And who are you going to choose to be in the face of all of those possibilities?

So whether it’s a conspiracy or whether it’s true, whether it’s real, whether it’s induced, just because we’ve medicated ourselves to the degree that the bugs that are surviving are superbugs, we have to realize that there is also an evolution of human consciousness at that same time, and we have the potential to transmute anything. If we will teach ourselves, organize and integrate and embody and root and ground, as we were speaking earlier, then our capacity elevates. And as our capacity elevates, we are capable of transmuting this current situation.

So it’s a long answer to a short question, but I think ultimately it boils down to this: It’s our choice, and it’s in there. The game is being upped because we’re up for the game being upped. And here we are at a choice point.

Rick: I want to give you time to talk about the Energy Codes. But a few more questions have come in. Do you want to just talk about the Energy Codes, or do you want me to ask the questions, and maybe you can kind of weave in some Energy Code stuff to the answers to these questions?

Sue: Let’s take the questions, for sure.

Rick: All right. So here’s one from Wesley in Oregon. He asks, “I have heard and often felt that certain mantras and prayers—for example, the Gayatri Mantra or, say, the Lord’s Prayer—carry the charge of the whole collective energy of the countless times they’ve been spoken throughout time. That chanting them, one is plugged into and adding to the power of that accumulated field energy.” Any thoughts on that, Sue?

Sue: I definitely concur with that. I also think that’s not the only reason they carry the power that they carry. I think the root power that they carry is the vibrational frequency and intonation, and what is activated in the system by letting them move through our individual bodies in vibrational frequency.

We’re made of light, and we’re compressed together into a physical body. On the way to that, sound is generated in that compressive state. The sounds of the Gayatri Mantra, for instance, are sounds that activate different vibrational frequencies throughout our whole system. As we repeat those tones, we become actively enlivened by the toning, and levels of our consciousness are enlivened.

And, of course, in the bandwidth of human consciousness that we’re all tapping into, the more that something is held as true at the conscious level through repetition over the years, over the ages, the more it enhances that in the very vibrations that we’re walking through inside this bandwidth that we share. So it was originally phenomenally profound, and it has only been enhanced because it has been held as sacred because of what it is, since the beginning of this recording. Yeah.

Rick: Yeah. It’s also said that these mantras, and the bija mantras that are often taught, if a mantra can be chanted out loud or thought in the mind, then there are actually subtler levels of that mantra as well. At the very subtlest level, it’s said that these powerful mantras are aligned with deep impulses of intelligence that are very fundamental to nature. We can call them gods or devas in that terminology, but using the mantra actually creates a collaborative relationship with that god or that impulse of intelligence. We help them in some way, they help us, and everybody’s happy.

Sue: Yes, a resonance of coherence, and ultimately an awakening. I also feel that we do merge with that frequency, so it doesn’t remain me and them, with them helping me; it becomes a we, and then it is an I. I am that as well, but I can’t get there with my egoic mind, with my material-based consciousness. I can only get there as a vibrational resonance.

When I allow my thinking mind to soften into the heart space and allow these tones to be spoken, then I’m activating that for the greater self.

Rick: Good. Martin from Germany says, “If the inner state is manifesting in the outer world, and my anger, or even rage, at being treated with injustice and humiliation is creating resistance and anger back from my opponents”—I think he means he gets angry, and then it comes back to him—“how do I change that? Do I have to love my enemies? And how would I do that? Or do I have to let them humiliate me and be submissive? In other words, how do I turn the situation around from the inside out?”

Sue: Yes. Well, you said it in the last part of your question: change this from the inside out. Loving your enemies is a wonderful thing to do, but your enemies are only a reflection of you. They are a reflection of that. Science is showing us that we’re just projecting our self onto a movie screen, and then we’re engaging with the self. Through that, we’re able to come to know what’s going on in here.

The fact that I have enemies reflects that internally I am not embracing all aspects of the self. Self-love is to stay on the self and to truly be loving into the self—or, more accurately, to be loving as the self. Then what happens is the idea of enemies disappears. When there is enough self-love happening, we emanate and radiate a different movie. We look at these people and see them not quite as the enemies they were before, but perhaps as teachers, or perhaps as reference points for me to glean feedback on how I’m doing at the game of self-love.

If I’m constantly bumping into friction and resistance, and people who are mean or not acting in love, then if that is an out-picturing of what’s going on in here, it simply means there are parts of me that I haven’t embraced yet. There are parts of me that I’m not loving into. There are self-judgments and compartmentalization that I’ve generated, and they are reflecting that back to me.

As I focus on changing this from the inside out, I take my attention off the enemies for a bit and utilize that as, “Man, if that degree of unloved or non-love is coming at me, it’s coming from me. So maybe I’m not mean to them, but maybe I’m not so nice to me,” just to put it simply. So start loving into those parts of the self that have gotten abandoned and thrown under the bus along the way. Start reclaiming them, calling them back, getting to know them, breathing into them with compassion, and beginning anew. What will happen is that when you look at these enemies, they don’t look quite so distorted any longer. There’s a refinement happening in the field, which allows you to have a different engagement there.

🧘 Practice and the Energy Codes

Rick: Yeah. Okay, this next question, I think, will help us segue into more about the energy codes. This is from Cameron in San Marcos, California: “How important is practice in the experience of true nature?”

Sue: Beautiful. Well, it’s not that we have to practice to relate to true nature; it is that we have to practice not separating ourselves from true nature. We have to practice stopping that. So practices, in my estimation, are designed to teach us how to undo what we landed here and began doing as a means of survivorship, not knowing who we were during the years when we were formulating our orientation here on this planet.

We kind of land in a splat, and our mind goes one way and our body goes another, and our consciousness is kind of hanging out to see if it’s ever going to be safe to drop into the river fully. Practices are how we gather ourselves again, so that we know that mind and body and spirit-breath are really unified; they’re really one thing. As such, we come to know ourselves as nature again. We’re awakening to true nature by using practices that call us back home again.

The mind is splattered out here, oriented to the external world. Through pratyahara, retracting our senses inward, we can come to sense, feel, and perceive the self in ways that we can never orchestrate that kind of understanding when our attention is externally oriented. Techniques, practices, regularity, a systemized way of coming back onto the self—all that they are doing is allowing you to discover the true nature that you are, which your mind alone never got to experience because it is only a certain fraction of energetic bandwidths. It’s not the whole.

When we are identified as the mind, we don’t feel complete, and we never will, because we’re not complete if we’re identified as the mind. So what we’re doing is peeling ourselves off of the mind, coming back onto the self, realizing we have a mind that’s to serve us instead of controlling the show. We have to get it into its proper role. Practices are what allow that to happen in a consistent enough fashion that enough of the photons are activating the sensory nervous system. Then this perception of self can happen consistently enough that we don’t forget. We don’t just have an aha moment and then, two minutes later, be upset at the guy who cut us off in traffic, thinking that it’s the end of the world.

Rick: A couple of things I want to hear you talk about more. One is the bus stop conversation—you can explain what that is. And then, let’s say someone reads this book, or eventually gets to go to seminars or workshops that you teach: What are they actually going to learn? So, let’s cover both of those things, if we could.

Sue: Sure. The bus stop conversation is similar to what might easily click for someone as a soul-contracts kind of idea, where we have an arrangement that I’m going to help you refine something and you’re going to help me refine something while we come into this realm in these bodies and live this life.

I used to describe it as a council conversation—a council of angels getting ready to come to Earth. We play out the roles and figure out who’s going to help whom with what. Then we come, forget that we had that conversation, and figure it out when we arrive. Then I found myself speaking at business conferences in medical communities where council-of-angels-type conversations weren’t going to fly. So I just tossed it out one day like this: “Okay, just imagine that you’re going to the bus stop to catch the bus to come to Earth. While you’re there, you strike up a conversation with others at the bus stop. You ask this guy, ‘What are you going to experience when you go in?’ and the other person does the same. Somebody says, ‘Well, I don’t know. I’ve never been.’ And somebody else raises their hand and says, ‘I’ve been there before. Crazy place. Super wild.

Last time I left, I coincidentally did this thing that they call forgiveness. It felt so amazing that all this energy just rushed through me, and I let go of all these things that I’d been carrying around forever. Boom, I just had this amazing revelation, and then it was over because I was on my way out. So I’m going back, and I’m going to do that again. But I’m going to do it sooner, and I’m going to do it bigger. I’m going back for a level 10 forgiveness, and I can’t wait, because what I felt was amazing. It’s going to be tenfold that.’”

“So then another person at the bus stop is like, ‘Wow, sounds great. How are you going to do that?’ That person says, ‘Well, I guess I’m going to have to, I don’t know, experience something that’s nearly unforgivable. Then I’m going to live with that and be angry and frustrated and compressed inside myself, get down the road, start feeling the physical effects of that, and my health is going to decline. I’ll live this contracted, compressed life. At some point, I’m going to get sick and tired of being that way. I’m going to reach inside myself, find some part of me that I don’t even know I had, some in-depth level of forgiveness, reach up and express it out there, and have this huge experience of forgiveness. I’ll get to know a part of myself that I never would have known.’”

“The other people at the bus stop are like, ‘Whoa, sounds amazing. How can we help?’ And the person says, ‘Well, somebody’s going to have to do something that’s nearly unforgivable. Like, drink too much at happy hour, get behind the wheel, cross the center line, hit my car, take my loved ones, cripple me—these kinds of things that could have been avoided. It has to be just completely wrong, the worst of wrongs. So who will help me?’ And everybody’s like, ‘Not me. I don’t want to be that guy. Who wants to be that guy?’”

“And so the conversation goes on, and it’s like, ‘Really, come on out. I bought my bus ticket. Here I am. This is my chance. Don’t leave me out.’ So somebody, finally, at the back of the place, raises their hand and says, ‘Okay, I can see how much this means to you. I’ll be the one. I’ll be the perpetrator, the one who does these nearly unforgivable things.’”

“So that can be translated in many ways in many different people’s lives.” Invariably, when I share this—whether I’m doing an online teaching, which I’m doing now, or when we were in the room together—people are crying and recognizing, “Oh my God, the person who abused me or the person who abandoned me actually was the one who finally raised their hand and helped deliver this scenario for me, which is going to allow me to reach inside and find maybe a level 10 self-love that I never would have found had I not been up against the adverse circumstances, the friction that was created from that dynamic.”

Rick: Which is not to say that an abuser can say, “I’m doing this for your own good.”

Sue: No. It is not that we ask for it in that way. And ultimately, that abuser is going to have to take inventory of what they came here to learn. So it might be self-forgiveness, it might be redemption, it might be something along those same lines that they will have to come to terms with. Whether it’s now or whether it’s, blink, blink, a few lifetimes later, it does resolve, because that is the way the universe works. It does abhor a vacuum; it wants to fill it with flow and unity. These kinds of concentrated energies that are unresolved cannot maintain themselves, so we’re here to resolve them consciously on this spiritual path, so that we don’t have to pay it out karmically in some kind of unconscious manner. We can dissolve that right here with our own awareness and intention.

The bus stop conversation is to allow this understanding on a more personal note: that there is purpose, that nothing is bigger than us, that we managed it, that we requested it so that we could awaken ourselves in certain ways. We are bigger than these individual circumstances that we are facing in this life.

Rick: Patanjali said to “avert the danger which has not yet come,” which means if you can work it all out within yourself, you don’t have to work it out karmically, as you just said.

Sue: Yes, yes. Beautiful.

Rick: Right, let’s talk about the energy code. So, tell us what this is all about.

Sue: Certainly. Well, we’ve kind of been talking about the energy code.

Rick: We kind of have been. Yeah.

Sue: Yeah. So, the book is filled with principles and practices. The principles are what we’ve been tapping into for a large proportion of our conversation. The practices are about how you start to do that. How do you come onto the self instead of being splattered and dispersed? How do you find ways to build the circuitry to perceive a greater sense of self, rather than being caught up in our survivorship, knee-jerk reactions, patterns, and habits that we’ve established, and even a sense of self that we’ve orchestrated over the course of our lives? How do we find that greater self?

It’s a series of practices that use breathwork, the conscious and subconscious mind, memory, and nerve patterning. They develop synapses in the brain and the body that allow circuits to be built to sustain a greater sense of healing, filtering, and cleansing, rather than the defensive, protective, guarded portions of the nervous system, and so forth.

I talk about body chemistry in very user-friendly terms so that people can implement lifestyles that generate an alkaline environment, where our immunity and robust vitality are present. I also place a lot of emphasis on how to understand and work with the individual circumstances happening in your life, and how to allow the body to serve the mind’s attempt to understand and translate those billions of bits of information bombarding us every millisecond. We are an energy field, and that information lands in the gut, not in our head. Then it rises up through the brain in our gut, is filtered through the brain in our heart, and rises up to the brain in our head. By then, it has been translated into images and ideas and perceptions that serve our lives here.

If we’re not living in our bodies, if we’re just living in our heads, then we overthink and don’t use the body to help us filter and translate these energies. We don’t know what to do with them, and we become anxious. We overthink and overpredict, and we’re analytical in ways that don’t serve us, as we’ve been discussing today.

For instance, a real, tangible, valuable technique people learn right away is how to breathe up and down through the Sushumna, this central channel in the body, and how to anchor ourselves in the body. As we learn to enliven this, it’s a great integrator. It activates the integrative energy that allows us not only to be loving, but also loving and powerful; not only loving and powerful, but also wise, creative, strong, spiritual, and capable, all at the same time. We don’t have to be either powerful or spiritual, or either powerful or loving. We can have all of that. We are made of all of that, and we want to be able to access all of it all the time, whenever it’s appropriate.

That central channel breathing, and then breathing for each of the energy centers and the levels of consciousness associated with them to enliven them specifically, is a fantastic part of it. What I really love about it is that we start working with energy instead of story. We start working with energy instead of the thinking mind.

If someone walks into the room and upsets you, instead of saying, “Why do you do that?” or “Why do I get so upset when you do that?”—either of which is kind of an unanswerable question. If we’re asking it, we haven’t been able to find the answer. Instead, we take people’s attention to the body and realize that the system will tell you exactly why that’s happening if you let the body speak. We learn a language of the body: a knot in your stomach means something different from a lump in your throat, or tightness in your chest.

I just realized I have an image here that I often use when I’m teaching. This flow of energy comes down through the body, hits the earth, rises up again, gets transmuted for human consumption, and rises up again. This energy actually is you. It’s an energy that runs through your body. You descend to the earth, you rise, and you rise as high as you can go, and then you cycle back around. That’s actually what creates the physical body. It’s a byproduct of regular energy flow.

If we allow it to ascend with the same purity as it descends, there are no problems. We live in this perfected field, and all is well. But most of us are living in a state something like this: we rise, and there are areas of our consciousness that have developed while other areas are still sleeping. So, the path of least resistance is what happens, and we rise in this kind of wobbly way. It causes a distortion in the biofield, a distortion in this flow. Now this individual is looking out through a distorted field. We see people who don’t care and lives that don’t have opportunity. We see in an obstructed manner because we’re looking through a distorted field.

What we’re doing with the Energy Codes is working on building circuits here instead of these gaps that we’re circumventing along the way. When you have a knot in your stomach, it’s because this energy is hitting right there, and then it has to go around it, et cetera. If you have tightness in your chest, the energy is hitting there. If you have a lump in your throat, the energy is hitting there and working its way around.

So, if someone comes into the room and you have a charge against something they’re doing, the reason you have a charge is that you haven’t really awakened to all that you are. You’re running on these compensatory pathways, and so that is appearing to be a threat. But if all your circuits were animated and activated, you wouldn’t see it as a threat at all. You would see it completely differently. Same person, same word, same actions, different effect.

We’re working on building the circuits so that we’re sitting here in this perfected system that is constantly reinventing itself, and so forth. The way we do that is, when somebody walks into the room and affects you, if you have a charge in your gut, throat, or chest—wherever it is—you squeeze it back, you hug it on the inside. Then you continue breathing in the ways I teach in the book or in the coursework, including the central-channel breath. Meanwhile, you’re anchoring yourself in the body so you don’t just become so expansive and “airy-fairy,” as you were mentioning earlier.

If we don’t root and ground, then if we expand, we have our tongue functioning. So, the majority of the interest is in grounding, integrating, and embodying. Now let’s find where these gaps are in our awareness that we could flood with energy, bring our consciousness into, and start breathing awake.

The layers of consciousness that comprise the levels of the body—the chakra system, et cetera—are there just waiting to be animated. Perhaps we’re not aware that we haven’t animated them. The body is constantly trying to tell the mind where we’re living and where we’re not. If it’s stiff, we’re not living in there. If it’s in pain, we’re not living in there. If it’s creating these reactive areas when circumstances happen in our lives, again, these are areas that haven’t yet become animated inside the system of wholeness that we are.

Instead of getting up into our heads and asking the story to provide answers, we take our attention to the body and let the body tell the mind, “Here’s why. Here’s why you have a reaction to that. It’s because your power center is not even animated. You’re not even active there. You’re circumventing every chance you get because of a pattern, a pathway that was established early on in your life.” You went to the bus stop, you created conversations that would bring people into your life to challenge that, so that you ultimately would find that you really need to do some work right here. How do you know? Because you’ve got this knot in your stomach all the time.

So, it teaches you how to deal with what you’re feeling in the body. Instead of trying to heal issues in the body, you realize that the body has just been trying to tell the mind all along where we needed to work with our consciousness as a team more readily, more consistently, and sooner. It allows us to begin doing that, trusting that the body is just revealing a language of the soul that the mind alone couldn’t interpret.

I approach it like this: the soul speaks to the body, and the body speaks to the mind. If the mind doesn’t listen, the mind’s busy writing stories. So, if we just direct the mind to the body, now we can start to learn, at the level of the mind, this language of the soul, which will allow mind, body, and breath to integrate into this soulful self and live the life that we’re seeking to live.

Rick: That’s great. Let me hit you with about four short questions and have you answer them all at once. Let’s say a person had been doing the Energy Codes for about a year. What does their daily routine look like? What kind of benefit would you expect the average person to have achieved, in your experience? Also, what is your retention rate? How many people—and related to that, do most people say, “Yeah, I can do this,” or do some people say it’s too difficult, it’s too complicated, things like that?

Sue: Beautiful. A regular routine is somebody walking around with one eye on the inside and one eye on the path. They’re constantly listening to the activations the body is generating, and they’re constantly working with flowing energy through those areas. They’re finding greater relief in their lives from a mental and emotional standpoint: less anxiety and a greater sense of well-being. Physical things heal. I’ve healed migraine headaches and scoliosis in my system, which is what got my attention to the degree that I started working with patients and clients even more.

Rick: That was really interesting about your scoliosis. You’d wake up in the middle of the night, your body contorted into some strange position, but it was like your body was actually readjusting itself. It was cool.

Sue: When my mind was asleep and out of the way, the body was starting to unwind and heal. People who are working and walking with these techniques are finding similar things. I often get reports that they’re waking up in the middle of the night. There’s nighttime yoga, I think it’s referenced in the book, where they’re in these different contortions because they’re breathing in this central channel.

I have several students who have been working with this for seven, eight, nine, or ten years, and they’re reporting all kinds of things: changing relationships, changing their ability to ask for what they want and need, and realizing that they don’t need the outer world to deliver these things, because they have them. They’re finding this abundance within, a greater appreciation for who they are in the world, and the confidence to speak their truths and be out in the world in a way they’d felt confined from, or separate from. And in so many beautiful ways.

I was just reading some cards this morning, with tears in my eyes, reading what’s happening in people’s lives. These have come in just since the pandemic, and I’m seeing what they’re experiencing and how grateful they are to have found ways to deal with this just by grounding and integrating in these ways. Let’s see, what was the other question?

Rick: Whether it’s easy for people, what kind of benefits they typically experience after a year, and what your attrition rate is, if you know.

Sue: Yeah, I’m finding that initially, people are very attracted to the ideas and like things such as the bus stop conversation and the other principles that I’m bringing in, and learning how to breathe in the belly and do central channel breathing. Then they learn simple things like Mula Bandha, which is locking ourselves in at the root of the spine, and anchoring in the backside of the heart chakra. They immediately feel a greater sense of self and presence. They feel that immediately.

Then they begin to realize that they can apply it in all these different life situations, where they’re not reacting emotionally, but they know the practices they can do in an instant. One of the things I love about it, and that people report they love about it, is that the Energy Codes don’t require you to sit and do practices for an hour a day or half an hour a day. They’re meant to be done while you’re living your life. They’re meant for that because life is showing you where, how, and which ones to implement at any given moment.

I developed them while I was living my life, while I was trying to learn to get back out into the world with this higher state of consciousness and this newfound vibration. Embodiment is what allowed me to do that, so I’ve just kind of reverse-engineered it. I’m teaching people how to expand their consciousness in the same way that I took this expansive consciousness and climbed into my body. We can open those same doorways to come up and out in a more expansive way, but always remain tethered in the physical world, so that these expanded realms can benefit us while we’re here in this life.

So people stick around; they stay. They love it. And sometimes people come back who thought it was too complicated or that they couldn’t do it. It really isn’t complicated once they start doing these four anchor points and central channel breathing. It’s home free. It’s just about finding yourself living inside this elevator shaft inside the body.

Oftentimes, people who haven’t been meditating or doing breathwork or that type of thing think, “Wow, what?” But then it lands for them and they get it. The moment that happens, they’re living in a different world.

Rick: Could people learn it entirely from the book, or is it necessary to have a seminar of some kind?

Sue: I wanted to write the book so that it was self-contained, but it definitely doesn’t hold everything I teach in the seminars, by far. For instance, I teach about chakras one through seven in the book. In the courses, I go to eight, nine, 10, 11, and 12. I start talking about concepts that I felt were too much to put in an introductory book. I’ll write another book that carries more of that content.

But I had to know that this foundational information was out there in book form, so people could read and follow it from cover to cover and have a self-contained body of work that would be full and complete in its own way. I didn’t want to just write a teaser to make people do something else. Somebody could read this book and have a treasure trove of information that will serve them for their lifetime.

If they want to know more and get inspired and enthusiastic about it, there is a lot of coursework available that has all invented itself. I didn’t sit down and say, “I want to teach six different levels of coursework, and I’m going to teach this and this and this and this in the first one, and then this and this.” I just taught the first one, and people were like, “We want to do this again.” So we did it again, and I taught it again. Then they were like, “Well, what else do you know?” So I was like, “Okay, let’s have a level two.”

Then we taught level two, and they were like, “Okay, what’s next?” Then it became, creatively, level three. It just birthed itself that way, totally as supply and demand: what people wanted to know and what I felt was beneficial, and what I was finding was helping my patients change their lives.

So, it’s there. The book is self-contained, and there is so much more if it’s a path and a way of living that somebody wants to know how to implement and activate in additional ways. That is certainly available as well.

Rick: So, how long have you been teaching it now?

Sue: About 15 years.

Rick: Wow. And the book was a bestseller in various ways. Do you have any idea how many people have learned it?

Sue: I don’t. I think we’ve added it up, because I also now teach people to teach the work. With our facilitators and practitioners out there, we’re estimating that we’ve taught probably close to about a million people who have actually learned the work itself.

We’re just getting started as far as exposing and really wanting to ground humanity, because these are times that this work was built for. I know that’s why this awakening happened with me when it did, and that I’m here at this time doing my thing. It feels like its time is right now. I feel like I’ve waited my whole life—not that I was waiting, but that right now is what it’s for.

It’s so accessible and understandable, and so easily integrated by people now. Things that I used to have to explain for 45 minutes, now in four minutes people are like, “Got it.” It’s like, “Awesome, let’s go to what’s next.” What I’m finding, even since the pandemic and teaching these courses online, is that I’m rolling information forward and I’m able to share with them faster, because this collective is like, “We’re on it. We’re ready.” So, I’m guessing that’s great.

Rick: Nice. Well, as I said in the beginning, it’s one thing to have a spiritual awakening, and a lot of people have them, but it’s another thing to be able to translate it into something that can help others have one or help others grow in certain ways. So, obviously, as you said, we’re kind of destined for this or made for this. And obviously it comes naturally to you. I think it’s great.

Sue: It’s my greatest joy. And I have to say that this interview has been absolutely blissful for me. Thank you. It’s probably one of the best interviews I’ve ever had. So, thanks.

Rick: Thanks. I’m feeling pretty blissful myself.

Sue: I’ve always said it’s relative to the quality of the questions and who’s interviewing you, what you get to share. So thank you very much for who you are, what you’re doing, and how you are serving humanity.

Rick: Oh, you’re welcome. Thank you. Maybe we’ll do another one when you’re on level 20 or something.

Sue: Oh, I’d like that.

Rick: So, let me just show your website. I’m showing your website on the screen right now. It’s drsuemorter.com, right?

Sue: Yes.

Rick: So people know what to do. They can just go there and hop over to your website and see what you have to offer. I’m sure you have an email list. I noticed there’s a free meditation there, so people can just explore that if they’re interested.

Sue: Thank you so much. It’s been my great pleasure.

Rick: And let me just say that next week I’ll be interviewing David Lorimer. David has had a distinguished career. Among other things, he’s the head of something called the Galileo Commission. It’s named that because Galileo couldn’t get the church authorities to look through his telescope to see the rings of Saturn or whatever, which, coincidentally, are actually showing on my screen right now.

That’s an interesting thing. I have all these outer space pictures that just rotate as my desktop picture, and there are the rings of Saturn. But in any case, he couldn’t get them to look at it, so they put him under house arrest and threatened to torture him and all this stuff, because he was suggesting that the sun was the center of the solar system and not the Earth. And that was heresy.

There’s a sort of materialist paradigm that dominates science these days, and many scientists are quite threatened by the notion that consciousness may be fundamental and not merely some epiphenomenon of brain functioning. So the Galileo Commission talks about this stuff. It has all kinds of seminars and courses and whatnot. This year, I think, is very interesting. So that’ll be next week.

Sue: Indeed. Sounds fantastic.

Rick: Oops, Saturn’s gone. I’m looking at some nebulae. All right. Well, thanks, Sue.

Sue: Absolutely. My pleasure. Thank you so much.

Rick: You’re welcome. Talk to you later.

Sue: Okay.